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    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    I’m currently on the home stretch of specifying a small EWI project onto solid walled brick and block. 90mm is the absolute max we can fit under the eaves so I’d rather this didn’t turn a debate about how much insulation I should have.

    We are trying to replicate the cant brick cills of the rest of the house over the EWI in bespoke brick slips to keep some architectural continuity between the main house and EWI region.

    My original plan (see image) was to add slips to the phenolic with brick slip Adhesive and point with brick slip pointing mortar. However the EWI system manufacturer recons this will void my warrantee as there could be stress on the insulation and their guidance states that cills must exert no stress on the EWI.

    My revised plan was to construct a structural cills from left over foamglass perinsul blocks and apply the slips to the rough glass edge after rasping it into the right shape (see image). However Corning state that nothing will stick to foamglass as its not permeable.

    Any suggestions on simple routes forward? I’ve seen details like this on EWI before but the only cast iron approach anyone can suggest is to have whole cant bricks bridging the EWI.
    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    second image
    • CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    Posted By: jms452My revised plan was to construct a structural cills from left over foamglass perinsul blocks and apply the slips to the rough glass edge after rasping it into the right shape (see image). However Corning state that nothing will stick to foamglass as its not permeable.

    You might have better luck with Marmox Thermoblocks instead of foamglass. I've no idea whether you can carve them but I'm pretty sure you can glue them.
    http://www.marmox.co.uk/products/thermoblock

    It might also be worth speaking to an adhesive manufacturer rather than the foamglass manufacturer; they might take it as a personal challenge to find a suitable glue!
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    Simply lay a 100thk piece of EPS on slope on top edge of the vertical EPS, rendered in with the rest, finish smooth with 2nd coat of the first coat material instead of textured finish and paint with slick silicone'y paint. Pic attached is best I can find.

    Looks 100% authentic stone cill. You can roughly make any shape you like in EPS - moulded architraves. cornices etc and decent plasterers can delight in the fancy-work skills they were taught but never get asked to deploy.

    Needs the slick paint - and to any near-horizontal surface - band courses, chimney moulds etc - to even-out runoff, and otherwise algea growth penetrates the textured surfaces, discolouring. Trad stone cills are frequently gloss painted even if the rest of the facade is matt limewash or whatever.
      2011-09-07 009med.jpg
    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    Thanks tom and dgh.

    Tom
    The stone cills do indeed look nice but won't match the rest of the house - maybe I could use a renderbrick system and apply the gloss paint to it and the rest of the cills so they all match but I'm not quite ready to give up on my brick cills yet.

    dgh
    Marmox has a conductivity of about 0.07 but the minimum order and delivery will be pricy - I could swap foamglas for something easy like celcon standard at 0.15 or celcon solar at 0.11 which I can buy individually for a couple of £. That is probably my best option to date and I could probably get the cill to a u value ot 0.5.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    I dont like reliance on silicone for long term weatherproofing of the window sill junction, could you cut in under existing wood window and....
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    go on...
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    uphill and slide in some lead or ali to form a sill with weathering or a drip over the newly formed on one
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    You reckon the glassfibre mesh reinf acrylic render top surface will crack up eventually and let water into the EPS? I don't mind a Al flashing over the top of it - cos will bend them up to order and powder coat quite cheap, even make a tray of it turning up back and ends of the window's cill. Just adds cost and complication.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    in behind the sill and spring off the slips etc, decay a nice sill detail, may be in behind the render too.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    eh?
  1.  
    Tom , I like the EPS sil idea , looks excellent , but do you think the corners could take a whack ?
    EWI renders pretty robust on the flat , I've tried hitting it with hammers and various sharp implements and managed to dent it but not crack or cut through to the insulation layer ,
    but i'm not so sure about protruding details like this , perhap a double layer of mesh and 3 coats (maybe a bit of cement in the mix ?)
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011
     
    dON'T KNOW - JUST AT THE BEGINNING OF GETTING TO KNOW ewi. (DRAT CAPS!)
  2.  
    I'll do a experiment on my own home sils and see how it goes
    •  
      CommentAuthorJSHarris
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2011 edited
     
    This may sound daft, but I've made lots of composite aircraft parts using EPS foam as the core and epoxy resin and glass cloth as the structural skin. The technique is easy to learn, doesn't smell much (unlike polyester resisn, which attacks EPS, epoxy is almost odourless) and gives great strength and impact resistance. It needs a UV resistant coating, but I'd have thought that it'd be a technique that might lend itself well to details like cills etc.
    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeOct 19th 2011
     
    JSHarris

    I think people use the same trick on surfboards - would probably work but I'm hoping for off-the-peg/proven approach that gives a real brick finish.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeOct 19th 2011
     
    Can't you get L-shape corners of stik-a-brik?
    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeOct 21st 2011
     
    fostertom - 'Can't you get L-shape corners of stik-a-brik?'

    This was essentially the option 1 detailed in the first post (but bespoke slip to match existing). However the insulation company decreed that it 'could' apply stress to insulation so could not endorse/guarantee. This seems a bit mad to me as they do endorse brick slips and it is thermally the best option. Its the 'Cill' label which seems to be the issue.

    Have you used L shaped brick slips to make cills with success before tom?
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeOct 21st 2011 edited
     
    No, and I haven't used slips at all yet - a pleasure to come!

    Find some competent plasterers, bypass the old fashioned EWI supply-and-fit cos or even the supply-only franchise holders. Like underfloor heating, all this stuff is on the verge of becoming commodity items, free of mystique.
    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeAug 27th 2012
     
    OK it took a while but I finally have solution I'm happy with.

    To recap this was recreating as close a match as possible of existing brick window cills on an partial EWI refurbishment.

    This used landscape laid celcon solar blocks (0.11) laid below the windows and cut to shape.
    The brick cills were then slips of engineering bricks cut to shape by a specialist brick cutter.
    The slips were then stuck on with an appropriate exterior grade tile adhesive.
    The EWI then just went round the edge of the cill.

    This leaves a strong cill, which can be constructed in advance of the EWI and is no part of the EWI system waranty wise.
    However, the resulting U value is better than the 0.8 window (although I admin poor compared to the wall).

    Photos below:
    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeAug 27th 2012
     
    photos
      Slide1.JPG
    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeAug 27th 2012
     
    and the end result...
      Slide2.JPG
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