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    • CommentAuthorfuncrusher
    • CommentTimeSep 12th 2012
     
    A couple of years back I floated the idea of a building a drying room for clothes: a small insulated airtight room/cupboard with a small dehumidifier. I now report on the reality. My son followed my scheme in his new house.8ft x 6ft room lined with plasterboard backed with 40mm foam insulation. No heating or ventilation. Small dehumidifier runs overnight on off-peak elec when drying required. Clothes dry in a few hours, room temperature rises to around 30C or higher - gives very efficient climate for dehumidfier and ALL the heat (inc latent heat of evaoporation/comdensation) remains in the house!. Energy consumption: probably under 1kWh per night - but remember that ultimately this merely heats the house and not wasted - whereas a tumble dryer exhausts to waste outside. Recommend a drying room is located next to a bathroom as the waste heat will help keep the bathroom warm. With careful design, it might be possible to build a 'heating window'' into the party wall, to regulate the temperature in the drying room and export surplus heat to the bathroom. Lots of possibilities - including a a vent which is time-controlled to open at 6.30am to heat upthe bathroom on cold mornings before you get up!

    Those short of space might consider modifying their bathroom to dual purpose.
    • CommentAuthorbeelbeebub
    • CommentTimeSep 12th 2012
     
    Sounds like a good plan!

    What you've actually built is a room sized heat pump tumble dryer!

    I wonder if you could do the same with a wardrobe sized unit, that you hang your spun dried (i.e. damp) clothes in on their hangers and over night a small dehumidifer dried them ready to be transferred into a regular wardrobe.

    Hell, just have a large built in wardrobe with a dehumidifer in, just hang straight in wardrobe where they dry take 'em out when you want to wear them. :bigsmile:
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeSep 12th 2012
     
    I have a condensing dryer built into my washer, the heat stays in the house (though the warmer condensate is pumped out).
    Though I do like this idea and the idea of just putting the clothes on hangers to dry, I do not own an iron, hardly any need being single :wink:
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    The rumpled look I call it - others call me scruff
    • CommentAuthorfuncrusher
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    Steamy Tea: I bet your condenser dryer is less energy efficient because you are importing electricity to actually dry the clothes by heating. Even if you recover all this heat as hot air, much of the year it will be surplus to requirements. Compare the the relative power consumptions, particular for multiple loads which can be handled simultaneously in a drying room.
    • CommentAuthoran02ew
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    Posted By: fostertomothers call me scruff

    Only behind your back:wink:

    I love this idea. And my wife does too. We have design our build to have a dedicated laundry room with drying space (a must with 3 children) but as of now i have only considered adding low grade heat, small DHW radiator. Now we will add provision for dehumidifier.

    Once again GBF has produced pure gold, i love it:bigsmile:
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    Posted By: funcrushermuch of the year it will be surplus to requirements

    I agree, actually only use it very sparingly, usually in the winter.
    We had a thread here a while back about the cheapest things we had done to save energy, mine was the washing line (clothes out on it at moment).
    I do like this idea of using a cheap dehumidifier (had one in the loft for years but owner took it back).
    • CommentAuthorseascape
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    I was just thinking about how to dry clothes in my new, yet to be built house! This sounds like a good plan for my bathroom. It's going to have a smallish tripled glazed window though so may not be quite as good as a large cupboard. Also need to look at electricity supply for the dehumidifier - what capacity/size dehumidifier have you used?
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    When I was a kid and we lived in a flat in the Netherlands, our washing machine was in the bathroom.
    Apart from noise isolation, I have often thought that having the washer upstairs is much more sensible, saves all that moving about.
    Just need very quiet washers.
    • CommentAuthorjamesw
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    Brilliant idea, and very timely for me - only minutes before reading this, I was looking at humidity-sensitive extractor fans to go into my planned basement utility room (which will be insulated on walls, floor and ceiling and will contain the gas boiler and hot water cylinder, and be used for washing and drying clothes).

    Like seascape, I'm interested in your dehumidifier specs. For my purposes I'd like one that can be plumbed in and wall-mounted, and preferably have a timer - any recommendations?

    Some seem to work using the Peltier effect, whereas many have compressors - which would be more energy efficient (I do appreciate that the heat isn't 'wasted', but I'm not sure that I need more heat in my utility room)?
    • CommentAuthorskyewright
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012 edited
     
    Posted By: beelbeebubI wonder if you could do the same with a wardrobe sized unit, that you hang your spun dried (i.e. damp) clothes in on their hangers and over night a small dehumidifer dried them ready to be transferred into a regular wardrobe.

    We almost do that.
    Our utility room has a long 'open' wardrobe / clothes rail along one wall.
    Spun clothes out of the washer, onto hangers hung from sheila maid (airer / dryer)[1], run dehumidifier[2] under sheila maid, clothes to wardrobe rail.

    [1] Assuming that it's not fit to put them outside.
    [2] A Mitsubishi that was recommended on GBF. It has "swing" louvre to give a nice varying breeze to shake the clothes a bit[3] and a "Laundry" cycle (among many other options).
    [3] No we don't do any[4] ironing either. :smile:
    [4] Well except for SWMBO's embroidery, but that's different.
    • CommentAuthorJTGreen
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    We were going to put up the sheila maid style airer in our kitchen, but my husband said no as it would ruin the space - I agreed. And no utility room or space for one, or a dedicated drying room.

    The alternative was to put up a wall mounted airer (brabantia wall fix) in the garden lean to/store. This also houses our bikes and wood and bins. It has a clear corrugated polycarbonate roof and lots of air circulation. I'm hopeful that it will be possible to dry clothes outside under cover pretty much all year round - maybe not as quickly as in a room with a dehumidifier, but certainly more cheaply. Yesterday it sporadically bucketed down here, but my sheets dried outside nonetheless.

    If it gets really cold and damp out, then I outside drying won't work and I will revert to a clothes airer in front of the stove. You can buy special humidifying kettles (!) to counteract the drying effect of woodburning stoves - I would think some damp laundry would work just as well.
    • CommentAuthorRobinB
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    We put the Sheila maid over the bath in our last house. It had high ceilings and we only bathed the children once a week. (Seperate shower).
    • CommentAuthorjimofwales
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    I do this exact thing in a spare room. Small room, sealed (although no insulation yet), with Mitsi dehumidifier. Works really well!
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    Posted By: an02ew
    others call me scruff

    Only behind your back:wink:" alt=":wink:" src="http:///forum114/extensions/Vanillacons/smilies/standard/wink.gif" >
    only behind the ears
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    Posted By: jameswdehumidifier specs
    I use windscreen wipers on my specs - you know like MG TA ones bolted to the top frame
  1.  
    Hi,

    Here is a link to a proprietary drying cabinet. Probably more cost than building one but seem to work.

    http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/blogs/dept/musings/alternatives-clothes-dryers

    Cheers

    Mike up North
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    We have been hanging washing outside for the past several decades, no tumble drier, no dehumidifier, s/h rotary line, cost = 0
    • CommentAuthorJTGreen
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    Ah, but if it's threatening rain and you want your washing out....you'll need my 'outside but under cover' washing line. This may be the innovation I'm most pleased with in the whole build.
    • CommentAuthorcrusoe
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012 edited
     
    Good idea! Still uses electricity though. A customer of mine wanted to use a ceiling-mounted drying rack for clothes - like the sort you use above an Aga - so we fitted a radiator in the shower room, which runs on a timer, independent of the other heating, using stored solar energy from the day before. This is an older end-terrace property. Works like the proverbial. Many ways to skin this kind of cat methinks.

    JTG: Is this a tarpaulin like mine? :wink:
    • CommentAuthorJTGreen
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012 edited
     
    No, it's a clear corrugated polycarbonate roof that keeps a 4.5 x 2.8 metre space at the back of the garden dry, in lean-to fashion. The 'walls' of the lean-to are the garden fences: solid alongside the access passage to stop opportunistic covetousness of our bikes, and 'full height but picket style' (i.e. with gaps) on the neighbours boundary and separating the lean-to from the rest of our garden.

    So, lots of air circulation, lots of solar gain (roof is south-east facing) and dry. It's where we store our bikes, bins, wood for the stove, gardening stuff, and have space for bike maintenance and where we have sited our wall mounted airer (a 'wall fix' - like a rotary airer, but it doesn't rotate and can be easily put away when not in use).

    That roof also supplies water to a second water butt and I'm hoping let a passion fruit (passiflora edulis) make it's way in there and see if the fruit will ripen. You could call it a holistic, eco-motivated design.
  2.  
    Those drying cabinets that Mike mentions are very popular here in Sweden, great for drying stuff when you come in from the snow!

    http://www.cylinda.se/Vara-produkter/Tvatt--tork/Tork/Torkskap/TORKSKAP-TS-190-ECOX-VIT-H/

    I'm sure it was on here that I saw mentioned a tent like affair that goes over a rotary clothes line for year round drying. I remember seeing them on ebay at the time much cheaper than they were selling on their online shop but can't remember the name and so can't find them again.
    • CommentAuthorcrusoe
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    There JT - isn't that better!! You really wanted to tell someone, and you did.....sounds like a plastic greenhouse with semi-open sides to me tho' :smile: This may spawn a whole raft of non-plastic eco-imitations...watch this space!

    Light sounds good in there too....?
    • CommentAuthorJTGreen
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012 edited
     
    I did want to tell someone (something wrong with that?), especially when a dedicated drying room with dehumidifier is regarded as an ecological solution to the 'problem' of drying clothes. If your benchmark is a tumble-drier than I guess it is. If your benchmark is a washing line.....how can it possibly be? (And I get that you gain the heat, but half the year you don't want or need the heat). Tony makes the same point. I guess I'm an advocate for the low-tech and for efficient use of space as a first principle of ecological design. A world in which a dedicated laundry/drying room is 'a must' requires a lot of resources (multiply that attitude by all the dedicated single-use spaces one might specify - Mr Blandings Builds His Dream House come to mind).

    The light is excellent. Glass (toughened) would be a longer lasting and perhaps more ecological choice. Sadly, compromises made on account of not being prepared to spend that kind of cash on what is ultimately just a lean to.
  3.  
    Hi,
    Likewise, I dont use one, I use the summerhouse - ie shed with extra windows. Dries really well even the heavy stuff, with the windows slightly open works fine.
    The point with the cabinet is that if its comercially viable and been taken to market then a few folk ahve looked at it and it perhaps isnt considered a crack pot idea. So go for your own versions if the original air dry can't work.
    Might be seen as a gadget but if part of the house then the heat balance works.

    Cheers
    Mike up North
    • CommentAuthorfuncrusher
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    You need a well insulated room for maximum drying efficiency, unless you are prepared to input additional heat. Small dehumidifiers have a fairly low wattage (exact consumption will depend on operating climate), and that needs to raise the air temperature as high as possible to get rapid evaporation AND rapid condensation by the dehumidifier. The latent heat absorbed by of evaporation is liberated on condensation from the air, so there is no net gain or loss of energy from that source. The speed of evaporation and the efficiency of the dehumidifier are both critically dependent on air temperature - so insulation and airtightness are critical. Once you have those in place, the actual size of the dehumidifier isn't critical - it may just take more time to dry. Set the the humidistat to max extraction rate (but not 'continuous'). A small domestic machine is adequate for the 8ft x 6ft insulated room. You don't need a timer as the dehumidifier (if properly set) will switch itself off when all is dry, providing the room is pretty airtight. We set our room next to the small laundry room on the same floor as the bedrooms to minimise transport of clothes. Obviously in a dry climate drying on a washing line is ideal, but often it's a rare option for many people.

    I looked up the suggested links to proprietary drying cabinets. My Swedish is nil so couldn't determine how that small wardrobe worked. None of the others seemed to be thermodynamically efficient; some merely heated cabinets with water-cooled condensers: what a waste of heat and water. A Bosch one boasted it only used 2kwH per cycle for a single load. A small room can dry several loads for about 1kWh, all of which is retained to heat the house; and furthermore in a room you can dry ANYTHING, not just clothes! Makes quite a good sauna too if you want one - hot and humid when the process starts.

    Washing lines in car port type sheds outside can counter rain - but not lack of wind or high humidity/low temperatures.

    Realistically a large share of national drying costs must accounted for by families with young children doing a load or more every day. What a boom a drying room would be for them
    • CommentAuthorfuncrusher
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    Someone just posted about greenhouses for drying.. We used polytunnel for years - but useless in winter unless sunny (a rare event) and interferes with horticulture in summer.Also, they have huge natural humidity if used for horticulture, which hampers drying. AND many town dwellers have no space in their gardens.
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    When it threatens to rain in the wettest place in the UK, I just put things on hangers and hang them from the curtain rail.
    When I moved into this place, it started raining on the first weekend, we had rain every day for 66 days, no one told me about that.
    I think this year has been pretty similar, campsites have been empty.
    • CommentAuthorEd Davies
    • CommentTimeSep 13th 2012
     
    Don't forget that the usual condensation risk considerations apply. In particular, you'd want the airtightness layer to be inside the insulation and be very sure it's complete otherwise you could eventually have some nasty mould behind the insulation.
    • CommentAuthorfuncrusher
    • CommentTimeSep 14th 2012
     
    Ed Davies : I said you need airtight room. No risk at all if use standard insulated plasterboard ( ie incorporating phenolic type foam insulation and vapour barrier). If you are neurotic, tape the joints with vapour-proof tape. Lino or tiles on floor.
   
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