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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

PLEASE NOTE: A download link for Volume 1 will be sent to you by email and Volume 2 will be sent to you by post as a book.

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    • CommentAuthormarsaday
    • CommentTimeOct 17th 2018
     
    I have just installed a tata roof. The product is good but the operation behind the scenes is not so people focused.

    The DIY route is certainly possible if just doing straight panels BUT any detail around window openings or verges and it gets a whole lot complicated.

    The install manuals are very poor to understand and i have had difficulty doing my square windows. Luckily they had a man in my area doing a course and so he came round for the morning and showed me how to do a window.

    He was saying the quality of instruction is poor and they have been on about doing some Utube videos for about 10 years, but no one will do them. A bit weird really because videos would end up selling loads more of this product.

    They haven't sent me enough self tapping screws for my job as well (plus the special silicone you need) and so i have asked them to send me some more out. They will but want to charge me £60 for 2 tubes and 100 screws.

    I am currently trying to get them to see reason that they are the ones who tell the customer what they need and are supposed to provide everything in the price quoted. I will now have to miss a good number of days and still have a non W tight building.

    I also have a 3 spare roof panels if anyone is interested.
    • CommentAuthormarsaday
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2018
     
    The cost for 100 screws and 2 tubes of silicone was actually £120.

    I sourced my own silicon and have used some capped brown self tap screws.

    Apparently i should know how much silicone and screws to use and so should have asked for more.

    I have never worked on a metal roof before and they were fully aware i was a DIY installer. So i was totally guided by their directions.

    I wouldn't use this company again, even though the end product is good.
    • CommentAuthorgyrogear
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2018 edited
     
    so guess it's ta-ta to tata...

    P.S. had a read of their installation manual -
    https://www.tatasteelconstruction.com/static_files/Tata%20Steel/content/products/Colorcoat%20Urban/Installation%20Guide%20Tata%20Steel%202014.pdf

    It requires thorough revision !

    "helping achieve forthcoming legislation".

    :devil:

    gg
  1.  
    Anyone have any idea of up to date prices. Have a very nice period village hall in the village that needs a new roof thankfully the property is not listed. Looking at copper seam if not to expensive but then also looking to attach solar direct to the seams using the special clamps so copper behind the solar would be pointless. Any suggestions
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeNov 7th 2018
     
    Posted By: renewablejohnlooking to attach solar direct to the seams using the special clamps

    Note that the clamps are not cheap :cry:

    Zinc or a lead grey colour might be appropriate? No idea on current prices, sorry.
    • CommentAuthorretrofrit
    • CommentTimeNov 7th 2018
     
    Went on a free Euroclad course a couple of years ago in S. Wales, well a one on one hands on training session with someone who had used the product, very good. Unfortunately learnt that metal wasn't suitable as we needed a large rooflight which is best welded. Shame it was a quality product for the price and not hard to fit, small scale (75 sq m) using a hand seamer. I ended up with rubber, well nobody can see it.
    • CommentAuthorretrofrit
    • CommentTimeNov 7th 2018
     
    • CommentAuthormuddy
    • CommentTimeOct 19th 2020
     
    I commented in this discussion previously.
    Recently I had to take up my standing seam aluminium roof apart because the plywood deck was showing a 'growth' and delaminating on its exposed edge.
    I am sure that I had installed it according to the suppliers instructions.
    Beyond the annoyance of having to do this, the biggest concern that I have is the number of corrosion perforations i have discovered through the aluminium next to the stainless steel sliding clips, and in a few cases next to screws fastening the deck.
    I had assumed that aluminium didn't corrode. But with condensation on the underside and a dissimilar metal it does.
    I was intending reinstalling it.
  2.  
    Posted By: muddyI had assumed that aluminium didn't corrode.

    Aluminium doesn't rust
    It gentle corrodes into dust !!!

    Something I remember from my distant past. You have to be very careful about what metals are in contact with ali. especially if there is (acid) rain about.
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeOct 19th 2020
     
    Posted By: muddyI commented in this discussion previously.
    Recently I had to take up my standing seam aluminium roof apart because the plywood deck was showing a 'growth' and delaminating on its exposed edge.

    Aluminium is sometimes used to make sacrificial anodes for boats and other things, as is zinc, because they are strongly electronegative. Stainless steel is on the other end of the scale - electropositive - which is why it doesn't rust easily. Put the two together in the presence of an electrolyte and the aluminium will corrode quite quickly. How old is your roof? I'm curious because I have a similar aluminium roof on a plywood deck :cry:

    The other question is where does the electrolyte come from? The clips are supposed to be protected from rain by the standing seam over the top. Pure water doesn't conduct very much but rain sometimes has enough impurities that it does to some extent. Salt spray is an infamously good electrolyte. On my roof there's a 'metal' underlaying membrane to allow any condensation or any other water that gets in there to drain out. (it's a normal breathable membrane with plastic 'scotchbrite' on top)

    Oh, and having reread the thread I note that we have some green staining on the north side, which looks a bit unkempt. The roof is mill finish aluminium. Our window cleaner is planning to have a go at cleaning the green off sometime. We had some very pretty sedum growing in the gutter as well, which I've removed and put in a pot.
    • CommentAuthormuddy
    • CommentTimeOct 20th 2020
     
    The membrane supplied was Permavent Eco. Standard roofing membrane which we had also used under tiles elsewhere on the barn roof. I now know that the metal roofing type exists. DJH, I hope that makes a difference.
    But the condensation should be pure water, unless it has picked up salts from the plywood, or even from the warmcell insulation between the rafters. So why corrosion?
    The roof from the inside is, plasterboard, intello plus vapour barrier, 9x3 timber joist with warmcell between, 50mm foil faced pu insulation, 18 mm exterior ply, breathable roofing membrane, Vieo roofing sheets. The pitch is about 5 degrees, facing southwest.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeOct 20th 2020 edited
     
    AFAIK, water has to be extremely, laboratory-pure to not be an electrolyte. For all real-world purposes, aluminium should never be in contact with other metals - any insulative separation has to be very robust, to be relied upon.

    Note, electrolytic corrosion doesn't happen just because the two metals are wetted by an electrolyte, e.g. a continuous film of same, like condensation. The two metals also have to be in direct contact with each other, so that an electrical circuit is formed.
    • CommentAuthormuddy
    • CommentTimeOct 20th 2020
     
    The stainless clips and the aluminium are in direct contact, and condensation is to be expected, so it should also be expected that corrosion will occur?
  3.  
    Do you find that dead leaves collect on the roof? It's quite a shallow slope.

    When a metal is partly in freely oxygenated air and partly in a low-oxygen environment like under decomposing leafmould, there can be 'crevice corrosion' around the deposit. This effect has drilled a lot of holes in the zinc-coating on my steel garage roof, which is rusting through in those places. The same effect can happen under the heads of fasteners.

    Are there any insulating plastic washer between the SS and the ali to restrict the current of corrosion electrons?

    https://fractory.com/aluminium-corrosion/
    • CommentAuthormuddy
    • CommentTimeOct 20th 2020
     
    Next time I would put a plastic layer between the stainless and the aluminium.
    Leaves don't accumulate, there is a thin layer of grime, to be expected. The corrosion is on the underside.

    I am in conversation with the manufacturer. They are questioning the intello vapour barrier as a sufficient vapour barrier.
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeOct 20th 2020
     
    Posted By: muddyThe stainless clips and the aluminium are in direct contact, and condensation is to be expected, so it should also be expected that corrosion will occur?

    It might be worth asking Euroclad. Depending how old it is and whether you state you are or are not trying to make a warranty claim, they might be more or less forthcoming? :devil:

    Their BBA just mentions a breathable membrane, so it's supposed to be OK with what you've got. Your roof sounds very similar to ours, although we don't have the layer of PUR. Yours has a fairly small slope so I suppose water might take time to drain. Ours is barrel-vaulted so there's a small area that's very flat and most of it is reasonably steep (it got called the ski jump while we were building it).
    • CommentAuthormuddy
    • CommentTimeOct 20th 2020
     
    Next time I would put a plastic layer between the stainless and the aluminium.
    Leaves don't accumulate, there is a thin layer of grime, to be expected. The corrosion is on the underside.

    I am in conversation with the manufacturer. They are questioning the intello vapour barrier as a sufficient vapour barrier.
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeOct 20th 2020
     
    Posted By: muddyI am in conversation with the manufacturer. They are questioning the intello vapour barrier as a sufficient vapour barrier.

    Refer them to Niall Crosson at Ecological Building Systems. He did a full condensation analysis of my roof, which also has Intello at the bottom and warranted the whole thing on the basis of it. Mind you, it was their breathable membrane I used as well, so that may have had something to do with it. But he should be able to reassure Euroclad.

    How long has the roof been there? Where is it?
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