Does anyone know the legals with regards to the drain in my photo.

I am currently on a shared combined system with my semi neighbour. I am planning on providing my own outlet and new drainage system as part of my new extension.

The current set up has my drains flowing under my old conservatory area (now dug out) and then under the neighbours wall, on through his conservatory and then down his drive.

There is also a weird drainage setup where one of the neighbours drains goes through his wall and forms a semi circle under my conservatory area and then tees into the drain run which goes under the wall. I think this was done in the past because of the conservatory the neighbour had built. So it is like an added loop to the drainage system. It is only an occasionally used over flow drain for his conservatory roof.

This drain will be right under my new foundations and i have suggested to do away with this underground pipe and instead allow the water to flow into my small section of guttering and down a drain pipe. This would then run horizontally along my new extension wall and fall into the first gully drain on my new line of drainage.

We are effectively removing any underground issues for the future.

My neighbour was all for it, but today has seen the pipe i have exposed and wants me to concrete over as you normally would do (lintels etc). I think he is having some issues with his elderly dad and so wasn't in the best of moods.

So as i understand it the drains have to stay, even though it seems crazy to have them under the extension.

Couple of questions:

1) you can see from the other photo taken earlier that my house was also using this drain to take water away for my washing machine. The previous owner put this in and had simply cut the pipe and placed and taped his new outlet onto this join. The neighbour says i must fix this pipe as it is broken.

What is my position here ? If the pipe is my neighbours am i also responsible for it because it is on my land ?

What happens in the future if the pipe gets blocked after the new extension is in place. Who fixes the pipe ? I will not be using it at all because my washing machine will be using my own new drainage ?

2) My neighbour has also said i cannot use his wall to run any drainage pipe on it. What is my position with regards to this wall ? Apparently he has built it off centre on his land so he owns it all. Does this mean i cannot use the wall to fit a trellis in the future for plants ?

3) The capping on the wall is tile and brick. One tile of the capping on my side has broken over the years (looks like it was broken to install the conservatory). He said i needed to repair it today as well.

4) Who would i see for some legal advise about this issue if i cannot work it out amicably.

My neighbour is a bit strange and i have tried my hardest to get on with him over the years. He had a huge fallout with his other neighbours about them building a wall. He is very sensitive about his property and everything has to be done right.

It was his idea about fitting the drain pipe to take the excess water instead of using the drain, so i am a little bit lost at the moment.

Posted By: marsadayWhat is my position here ?

Somebody else's drain in your property is called a 'lateral drain' and isn't either you or your neighbour's responsibility. It is the responsibility of your water authority.

If the brick wall in the photo is 'his' wall then I think, but am not sure, that the Party Wall Act is likely to be involved.

Given your description of the situation, I think you need either:

- a solicitor who is expert in party wall and shared drainage issues, or

- a surveyor of such issues who is also legally qualified, or

- a firm that employs both surveyors and solicitors

You also need to speak to your water authority before making any changes to their drain, and before attempting to make a new connection to their sewer.

Posted By: marsadaySo do you think the best plan is to speak to the water company tomorrow and see what they say ?

Yes

I was under the impression that any gray / black water domestic connections were private drains when they serve a single property (irrespective of the land they are on, and the responsibility of the person who uses i.e., gains benefit them) and with recent-ish changes is legislation, any shared drains were defined as sewers and the responsibility of the sewerage untertaker (water company?)

So single pipe only used by neighbour is his responsibility only; if you tap into / join it, its a sewer (belonging to the water company) from that point. If you tap into 'their' or a private pipe, its a sewer downstream from there. The Water co may stipulate the standard you do this to; it might be under building regs.

From your most recent post, sounds like the water co think its a single-use drain.

If you are seeking to divert a private drain not for your use but on your land, which it sounds like you might be, you might need to dig around further, literally or figuratively...

Spoke to a surveyor and he seems to think i can reroute it so long as it leaves the neighbour no worse off. So this is potential better news. Means i have to dig up that block of foundation though :(

Where is the nearest manhole?

The responsibility for some drains changed in 2011(?). Perhaps scroll down to the diagram..

https://www.stwater.co.uk/households/pipes-leaks-and-drains/responsibility-for-sewer-pipes

No, it doesn't. His private drain from his conservatory becomes their lateral drain as soon as it enters your property and it turns into a shared sewer where your drain joins it. If you check the Altering your property tab, it says you need their permission before starting work, so I'm pleased they are coming to see it. And their Building & Developing page says "If you're making any change to an existing sewer connection for e.g. - change of development, flows, utilising an existing connection. This will require our approval. You can't connect to a public sewer without approval from Severn Trent."

It should all work out well, but especially given your neighbour's touchiness, I still suggest getting some professional advice.

The water company say it is 100% private, but they haven't stipulated who actually owns it (me or the neighbour). I have emailed then again to clarify.

I have my deeds at home and there is no mention of this issue in there. The alterations were done maybe 20 years ago. This loop has been put in i think because my neighbour did not want the drain going under his new conservatory base and foundation. So he routed it out to my garden and back through my own connection which heads over to his property.

At the time all this house had in this position was a patio i think. The owner at the time then built a conservatory over this drain, but the foundation just missed it. I am wondering now if the building of the conservatory meant the pipe work had to be rerouted more under the base of the conservatory so as to allow the foundation for the conservatory.

I have also spoken to OFWAT today and they say i should get more info than has been provided by the water company. I have sent a new email asking for specific responsibility information. They must be able to say who is responsible. They could well be passing the buck.

The water company came out after i spoke to OFWAT yesterday.

It is privately owned and i think it is shared. It is not directly running off the main sewer line, but rather feeds into it from my side, so not the water companies pipes.

BC came out today as well and we have agreed to alter the drainage under the foundations to cross at 2 points, as it currently runs in the foundation channel. I will have to do bridging.

My neighbour has a recessed hopper made out of lead and so he doesn't want this altering. I didn't bother pressing him on this issue as he is an unpleasant fellow. The easiest solution was to make this hopper fully water tight and let it fall into my gutter (which it is also doing anyway as a secondary backup). I would then run a surface black drain against the wall and into a new bottle gully. All over the land rather than under it.

Dogmatic, his wall is his, his house is a castle etc etc. He doesn't want to get involved with another person working on his property as he had a huge fallout with his other neighbour over a new wall. The problem firmly lies in his head, but i am pragmatic and will do what is required now i know i can proceed. Altering the drain won't incur a huge cost as i am doing the work.

The water guys were good though and i am glad i spoke to them as my plans to run my own drainage out into the road was not going to work out. So i am sticking with the main water pipe running under the full width of my extension and meeting up with this weird semi curve set up. The water guys said this would never have been done though under their control, but it was done 25 years ago and all above board with BC as well.