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    • CommentAuthorgravelld
    • CommentTimeSep 1st 2017
     
    Do you need to buy an EWI "system"?

    Slightly provocative maybe. But having been browsing around and talking to staff at these firms it appears they offer:

    - Centralised purchase of (most of) the system
    - A guarantee
    - A bunch of details already drawn up
    - Staff to customise details, and software for analysis (moisture etc)
    - Training for installers

    Just wondering if others have been tempted to spec their own "system". I wonder if anyone with enough tenacity can manage much of the above.

    How much of a premium are we paying for the above?
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeSep 1st 2017
     
    I have only ever done EWI on my own, sometimes buying products specifically designed for EWI other tomes buying the bits on their own
  1.  
    Over here the vast majority of EWI is done by jobbing builders, although they must have done an industry course before they can undertake an EWI job. Materials are bought at the local builder merchant although there are web shops that will sell you a package of materials but not usually much cheaper than the local merchant.

    The 'standard' EWI is 10cm, up from 5cm a few years ago and I have noticed 15cm becoming more frequent. Often 20cm will be a special order. The price is by the M3 so 10cm is double the price of 5cm and half the price of 20cm.

    So IMO the firms selling an "EWI system" are adding no value to what a competent builder or knowledgable DIY person can do. Any premium added because it is a "system" IMO is hype and I can't see a guarantee being any better than the liability of a builder.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeSep 1st 2017
     
    +1
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeSep 1st 2017 edited
     
    Posted By: Peter_in_HungaryI can't see a guarantee being any better than the liability of a builder.

    Unless it's an insurance-backed guarantee.

    I suppose the main reason for 'systems' is for projects where tick boxes have to be ticked.
    • CommentAuthorDarylP
    • CommentTimeSep 1st 2017
     
    All the 'guarantees' from system suppliers dictate that they only pay out where the 'system' has been installed 'properly'.
    So in other words, if the 'system' has been installed properly, they will cover you if the system fails?
    Otherwise, claim off the installer....
    So in nutshell, the system guarantees are not worth the 'paper':angry:
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeSep 1st 2017
     
    +1
  2.  
    Also note that the companies can sometimes get fixings etc. that aren't available to you or I.

    When I was figuring out my cladding package it looked like the only decent (i.e. thermally broken) insulation anchors from the likes of Hilti, Ejot etc. were specialist items, only for trade purchase by installers.

    In the end we're probably going to go with one contractor for the whole envelope package anyway so I got around it, but don't know what the workaround is if you do want to DIY.
    • CommentAuthorgravelld
    • CommentTimeSep 1st 2017
     
    Anyone looked at the extra cost a "system" adds?

    Or could it save money in terms of materials, as the system maker purchases the base materials at a lower rate?
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 2nd 2017
     
    The advice of the 'system's' travelling rep is totally invaluable, at least in case of Parex for SW England.

    He will assess the firmness of the existing wall surface, incl if dodgy old paint finish is a bit loose, hence whether you can (usually) get away with adhesive fixing, or have to use mechanical fixings. He will also return to site to help your plasterer get the hang of the rendered finish - and any other support you need.
  3.  
    Posted By: fostertomThe advice of the 'system's' travelling rep is totally invaluable, at least in case of Parex for SW England.

    He will assess the firmness of the existing wall surface, incl if dodgy old paint finish is a bit loose, hence whether you can (usually) get away with adhesive fixing, or have to use mechanical fixings. He will also return to site to help your plasterer get the hang of the rendered finish - and any other support you need.

    Any decent builder who is up to doing EWI should be able to assess the suitability of any surface proposed for EWI and recommend remedial action to ensure a quality job. Getting a couple of quotes anyway will help.
    If the plasterer needs advice to get the rendered finish properly done - then you are using the wrong plasterer !
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 2nd 2017
     
    Posted By: Peter_in_HungaryIf the plasterer needs advice to get the rendered finish properly done - then you are using the wrong plasterer !
    Not at all -everyone has to do it for the first time, and is foolish to turn nose up at good advice and demo.
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeSep 2nd 2017
     
    Posted By: fostertomeveryone has to do it for the first time

    Indeed, but in general it's good advice to avoid tradesmen who are learning at your expense. Apprentices should learn as apprentices, not make-believe tradesmen.
    • CommentAuthorgravelld
    • CommentTimeSep 2nd 2017 edited
     
    On that note, the systems company I was talking to on Friday gave their day rate for training... It ain't cheap, I suspect the client pays too.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2017
     
    That's an ideal world Dave - usually it's a challenge to find any half-good plasterer when you need one. And then it's completely possible to get a good job first time he's done it, with a bit of initial guidance.
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