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  1.  
    By way of contrast when I renewed the last of my 4 windows and balcony door I sent the supplier (recommended to me) the dimensions by email and got a quote for supply and fit in a few days, after I accepted the quote I had a visit from the rep - who was the owner of the family business - who inspected the house and measured up for the windows and door and they were fitted some weeks later. Hassle and worry free. Perhaps an advantage of using a small family firm. And the price was competitive with the rest of the market place.
    • CommentAuthorgravelld
    • CommentTimeOct 31st 2017 edited
     
    Posted By: MarkyPI sent drawings to the supplier and chose a window type

    Drawings including dimensions I assume - for openings I understand there are different ways of drawing those "V" sections from hinged opening; assume you asked them which way they do it, or you made it explicit? Are there other standardised notations?

    Posted By: MarkyPTook hours and hours (or days and days) of my time to check and double check each window detail was correct.
    Which type of details do you mean?

    Posted By: MarkyPBased on my experience there's no way I'd put a large window order in the hands of a builder/main contractor. Maybe architect/designer who had experience of windows, especially if repeat experience of the supplier/product. I daresay some suppliers have a better, more actively managed specification/quotation process as well. I did it myself out of necessity rather than choice. I'm overall happy with the results, but with the benefit of hindsight I realise now I made a few bad decisions.
    Sounds like this is a minefield!
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeOct 31st 2017
     
    Posted By: MarkyPBased on my experience there's no way I'd put a large window order in the hands of a builder/main contractor. Maybe architect/designer who had experience of windows

    I found it was useful having an architect, since he knew what to prepare in the first place but mainly because he checked each draft of the quote. But there's no way I'd leave it all to him. I had to check the quotes as well and we each found some of the mistakes.

    Quote details include window model, size, opening type and hinge position, glazing type (i.e. glass and coatings etc). Here's a sample:

    Unit Ref: GW07
    Type: Thermax 2 Ultra: 3k Alu-clad Tilt & Turn Window
    Pieces: 1

    Configuration: LH Hung Tilt &Turn Window
    Unit Dimension:1444x1003mm
    Glass:SWS G1
    Finish:Two Colour RAL8019 Externally & RAL9010 Internally
    Handles:Hoppe Key Locking
    Trickle Vent:None
    External Sills:Aluminium RAL8019 with 160mm Projection
    Window Boards:NO

    Clear opening at 90°:
    Frame Material:Redwood
    Aluminium Drips:N/A
    Hinge Colour:White Hinge caps
    Unit U-Value:0.76 W/m2K

    Plus a drawing showing sash arrangement.
  2.  
    When I did mine I made sure that myself and the supplier were both viewing the windows from the same side. Some suppliers view from the inside, some from the outside.
    • CommentAuthorgravelld
    • CommentTimeNov 1st 2017
     
    @djh Assume the "Dimension" is the entire unit, i.e. the opening minus-a-bit?
    • CommentAuthorMarkyP
    • CommentTimeNov 1st 2017
     
    another detail to look out for is the colour of the glazing tape (the edge bit that is visible between the panes all around the permiter of the window). This wasnt menioned anywhere in my spec and I only asked becuase I read a post on here which discussed it. It would have been white by default and I had it changed to black to blend better with my dark grey frames. You also need to keep an eye on egress windows (non-key locking from the inside) and also any below the height where toughened glass is required.

    there is a lot to consider but you just need to go over it all exhaustively again and again until it's right. Then check it again! Watch out for mistakes creeping back in as the supplier sends back ammendments, I had a few issues with the supplier changing the bit I asked them to change but they must have edited an older copy of the sheet and so re-introduced a load of previously corrected errors.
    • CommentAuthorgravelld
    • CommentTimeNov 1st 2017
     
    Sounds like it's the unknown unknowns that might catch you out! White tape on dark grey frames sounds strange as a default?
    • CommentAuthorgoodevans
    • CommentTimeNov 1st 2017
     
    I have also seen the spacer bars coming in different colours - so both tape and spacer colour should specified (ideally to blend with the frame colour).
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeNov 1st 2017
     
    Posted By: gravelld@djh Assume the "Dimension" is the entire unit, i.e. the opening minus-a-bit?

    Yes, that is clear in the drawing. The quote has it stated in bold which side the windows are viewed from.

    Posted By: MarkyPanother detail to look out for is the colour of the glazing tape (the edge bit that is visible between the panes all around the permiter of the window). This wasnt menioned anywhere in my spec and I only asked becuase I read a post on here which discussed it. It would have been white by default and I had it changed to black to blend better with my dark grey frames. You also need to keep an eye on egress windows (non-key locking from the inside) and also any below the height where toughened glass is required.

    The bit between the panes is the spacer and the exact type of spacer to be used was part of the glazing specification in my quote. Glazing tape or gasket is used to adhere the window to the frame on the inside and outside and is generally not visible, or hardly so. All our windows have locks and most of those upstairs are egress windows. We are careful to keep a window key near the egress window in our bedroom for example. Whether or not the glazing is toughened in any particular unit is part of the glazing specification and as you say, it needs to be checked carefully. SWS G1 in my example and in the context of Thermax 2 Ultra: 3k means triple-glazed float inside / float middle / float outside with Swiss spacer, for example. G2 was toughened inside and G3 toughened all three panes. There was also G4, G5 and G3/G5.

    there is a lot to consider but you just need to go over it all exhaustively again and again until it's right. Then check it again! Watch out for mistakes creeping back in as the supplier sends back ammendments, I had a few issues with the supplier changing the bit I asked them to change but they must have edited an older copy of the sheet and so re-introduced a load of previously corrected errors.

    Exactly, you can never do too much checking! We had twelve versions of our quote before we approved it. A lot of it is quite tedious but essential - we have three external doors of the same basic design, for example, with left-and-right handedness, square or tall inset windows and red or white exteriors, but no two of the doors are the same.

    It's the same with anything, though. Checking the kitchen cabinet details took a similar amount of work. It's just a lot more expensive to change a window if the spec is wrong than a kitchen cabinet :devil:
    • CommentAuthorMarkyP
    • CommentTimeNov 1st 2017
     
    spacer, thanks, that's the term I was looking for. Whether white was the default or just what the estimator selected for me, I'm not sure. Only when I asked was it clear that there were options. Gasket came black, luckily, that's another one that was not mentioned anywhere in my spec now I think about it.
    • CommentAuthorMarkyP
    • CommentTimeNov 8th 2017 edited
     
    we drifted a bit off topic with windows so here's another pic from last weekend's efforts. This shows the adhesive pattern which seems to be the standard method when using a mortar type adhesive. The aim is both to provide sufficient bond to the wall, but also prevent formation of continuous air spaces behind the boards. One issue I've seen dicussed is that of adhesive being pushed into the joints between the boards. This hasn't been too much of a problem, with care you can fit the board such that you slide it tight to the board below and one to the side if present, as long as you dont push the board home with a gappy joint between other boards, the adhesive seems to stay where you want it. One thing we did find was that abutting windows and door frames it helped to lay the adhesive 50mm in from the edge of the board, reason is that angled cuts around reveals often werent 100% tight fit (foamed later) with adhesive on the edge of the board it did get squeezed back around the frame until we change method.

    renderer comes next week, just in time for the cold weather!
    :cry:
      IMG_0746.JPG
    • CommentAuthorMarkyP
    • CommentTimeNov 8th 2017
     
    the eagled eyed might notice the pink colour to the board pictured. I ened up using two different types of EPS. The majority was sourced earlier in the project and is Kay-Cel Vita Super+. I'd under ordered so needed more and lead times for Kay-Cel were huge. Baumit supplied me some at a similar price. The different branded boards were both enhanced EPS, datasheets read the same in terms of spec. However, the Baumit supplied boards (branded Austrothem EPS F) had a pink coating on side, I was told to put this to the wall on the adhsieve side, but I didnt get an explanation as to what it was for. They were also made of a larger EPS grain size and noticably softer. The Kay-Cel boards were somewhat denser with a smaller EPS grain. The Kay-Cel boards were 1200 x 600, the Baumit 1000 x 500. I found the Kay-Cel boards more reassuring in terms of compressive strenght and stiffness, but they were a pain to work with. The smaller boards were much easier to move around, especially once loaded with adhesive and especially so when working on the scaffold. From my expeirence, I'd recommend 1000 x 500 boards as a better size.
    • CommentAuthorgravelld
    • CommentTimeNov 8th 2017 edited
     
    As in the other thread, worth just putting the water tight base coat on and then finish next year?
    • CommentAuthorMarkyP
    • CommentTimeNov 8th 2017
     
    possibly though I'd really like to get it all done. We're going to have to take a day at a time and see how it goes. I'm hopeful next week will at least allow all the basecoat to be done. That will need at least 4 or 5 days to dry and cure, then we'll have to see what the weather is like and make a decision about top coat. I think the top coat will take less time to cure/dry as is only 1.5mm so optimistic we can grab any milder spells to get it done.
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