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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
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  1.  
    Our main electricity supply cable hangs from a pole to the eaves of the house, runs down the face of the wall, then into a meter box set into the wall. We'd like to EWI over all this. Does anyone know what happens?

    Main supply cable - does this need to be disconnected during the EWI (weeks with no power?) and replaced later on the surface of the EWI? Can the EWI run over the cable???

    Meter box - the details on the web suggest the EWI should stop at the door of the box, leaving a lip and a big cold bridge. Is there a better way?

    Who coordinates the work between the EWI co, power network operator, and electric company?
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeJul 20th 2019 edited
     
    Posted By: WillInAberdeenCan the EWI run over the cable???

    I doubt it, since it would need derating (i.e. a larger cable would need to be installed) and it belongs to the DNO (or somebody, but not you) so they likely want to keep access to it.

    I think it is you that coordinates activity, though with help from some of the participants. You will need to involve:
    (1) your DNO, who will move and reattach the supply cable and meter box (why not get the whole lot put underground while you're at it?)
    (2) your supply company, who will arrange for
    (3) their meter operations company to move and/or reconnect the meter
    (4) your electrician, who will reconnect the meter to your CU, possibly after retesting your house installation

    I would start by contacting my electrician and the DNO and progress from there. A EWI company may also be able to advise? DNOs have descriptions of similar work flows on their websites.

    I guess it may be possible to run the supply cable down the outside of the EWI and surface mount the meter box on the EWI, but I have no real idea.

    edit: PS it won't take weeks. You'll want to arrange that the affected piece of wall is stripped of electrical stuff, EWId and electrics reinstated as quickly as possible (how fast can EWI and render be applied over a small area?) or else arrange for a temporary supply (generator hire maybe?).
    • CommentAuthorGreenPaddy
    • CommentTimeJul 20th 2019
     
    Agree with dropping underground. Dig the trench yourselves (ie not by the DNO), they will cut and joint with a longer cable, into the "cutout", so that way you won't need to invlove your supplier to deal with the meter.

    The meter box needs some thinking about. Ideally you might move it a bit, but then you're back to supplier involvment. You might be able to just eek it out from the wall a wee bit so it becomes surface mount on the exist block wall, then surrounded by the EWI to become recessed again. You could fill behind it with insulation, to reduce the impact of the missing EWI from that meter box area.
    • CommentAuthorGreenPaddy
    • CommentTimeJul 20th 2019 edited
     
    Meant to add, since the mains cable run from the ground up the wall would only be inside say 1m length of EWI, and it would be run inside a "hockey stick" duct, I don't think there would be an over heating issue, but check that.
  2.  
    Thanks, there's no possibility of putting the supply underground (too many things in the way!).

    I think we can coordinate the DNO and EWI co, but involving any more parties than that is too much risk.

    (For background, we are looking at EWI as a less disruptive but more expensive alternative to IWI, as we will be living in the house. If it involves long power outages then we might be better IWI'ing that wall instead!)
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeJul 20th 2019
     
    Posted By: GreenPaddythat way you won't need to invlove your supplier to deal with the meter.

    I don't think that's how it works. The DNO will move the meter box, but only after they disconnect the supply. The only people allowed to reconnect the meter are the supply company and the only person allowed to reconnect the meter to the CU is your electrician, after certifying that the installation in the house is safe. So I don't think there's any way to avoid involving all of them.

    Posted By: WillInAberdeenI think we can coordinate the DNO and EWI co, but involving any more parties than that is too much risk.

    I don't think you have any choice in the matter :( It's not as bad as it sounds, IME.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeJul 20th 2019
     
    Unless you donโ€™t disconnect it ๐Ÿ™‚
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeJul 20th 2019
     
    Posted By: tonyUnless you donโ€™t disconnect it

    Ha, ha, very funny :bigsmile: :bigsmile:
    • CommentAuthorbxman
    • CommentTimeJul 20th 2019
     
    Hi W in A

    IMO do not mix EWI and IWI with EWI the walls become part of the thermal mass of the house and this helps stabilise the temperatures within the house .

    My mains comes up the exterior wall to an external meter box on the wall the EWI goes over the cable and around the box not ideal but what normal commercial companies do .

    With smart meters there may not be the same need for external meters so maybe you could persuade your supplier to move the meter without ripping you off although sods law says the signal will work outside but not from inside I am sure .
    Good luck .
  3.  
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeJul 21st 2019
     
    Clever and simple
    • CommentAuthorGreenPaddy
    • CommentTimeJul 21st 2019
     
    Will,

    Plan B...since u/g not an option.

    1. Move the existing mains feed owned by the DNO, presumably SSEN, so it is firmly held the EWI thickness off the wall. Some sort of threaded rod, with cable clips on the end.

    2. Slide the entire meter box out of the wall, the depth of EWI so it's going to be still recessed after the EWI is finished. May need to move the box up or down a few mm, so the mains feed cable and the tails to the DB don't need lengthening.

    3. EWI can then be installed to either side of the cable fixing bars, like a movement joint with the plastic angle beads running vertically.

    4. Apply render layers.

    This removes any dependency on any outside agency. Spark prepares everything. EWI guys follow on.

    You're not "altering" any DNO cable, you're not disconnecting any supplier meter. You're not touching anything inside the meter box apart from fixing screws on the plywood board which you are responsible for installing anyway. No one will know or care.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeJul 21st 2019
     
    ๐Ÿ‘Œ
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeJul 21st 2019
     
    Sorry, but I don't think that flies. The cable belongs to the DNO and you're not allowed to touch it. The meter belongs to the supply company (and yes,obviously it gets bought and sold as often as you change supplier) and you're not allowed to touch that. Your electrician has to continue to work with these guys. You will be discovered the next time the supplier sends a meter reader (i.e. within two years).

    So it's a simple choice of whether you want to work with the system (which generally works pretty well) or set yourself up for a fight with them. As I said before, I recommend talking to the DNO and your electrician to see what they suggest.
    • CommentAuthorGreenPaddy
    • CommentTimeJul 22nd 2019
     
    I move or install new elect/gas/water meters a few times every year for clients. Usually I get the elect meter installed and the power made live before the frame is finished, or even started in some cases.

    So the board onto which the mains cable, cutout, meter, and tails are mounted is not in its final location (to within 6 inches or so but not finally mounted).

    Meter installers and the network linesmen have no problem whatsover with me moving the entire board to suit the wall position or leaf thickness build up, happily leaving some slack to accommodate this.

    So the only issue is the mains cable attached to your wall. The DNO won't want to get involved with selection and fitting of the special cable mount extension rods, as they penetrate your EWI. So they would want those installed so they can unclip 4m of cable and reclip.

    They are not going to be interested in sending a team to site to unclip and reclip. If you wanted to fix a crack in your wall/render, and had to unclip the cable to repair the crack and reclip, you wouldn't call in your DNO to do that.

    I'm moving another meter mid August, so if you can wait till then, I can ask the SSEN site team, if they would expect a call to reclip a cable.

    As to a meter reader noticing a recessed meter box is still a recessed meter in the same position...what is there to notice? You haven't even physically touched the meter.

    Only possible problem is if the tails from the meter to your DB can't be made to reach, then either a hot extension by your spark, or you will have to get the elect supplier to connect the longer tails, which your spark will provide, into their outgoing side of the meter.
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