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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

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    • CommentAuthorbardo
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2019
     
    We are obligated to install a sprinkler or mister system in our new build under Welsh building regs. Does anyone here have experience of this? I'd like to discuss costs and options. Our flow rate isn't great and it has been suggested we look at mister systems.
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2019
     
    I've no experience but I believe misters are well worth looking at. IIRC they do less damage than a sprinkler and are at least as effective. No idea about costs. If your flow rate isn't big enough you may need to install a tank.
    • CommentAuthorjfb
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2019
     
    is it a tall building? or do all new builds need a sprinkler system in Wales? If the latter that seems weird to me.
    • CommentAuthorbardo
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2019
     
    Yes, mandatory for all new builds since 2017.
    • CommentAuthorJeff B
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2019
     
    My brother-in-law lives in west Wales and has recently moved into a 2019 new build. The house (a normal 3 bed, 2 storey semi) does not have either a sprinkler or a mist system. Are you quite sure about this being a legal requirement?
    • CommentAuthortychwarel
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2019
     
    it is required for all new builds registered for building regs purposes since 2017, buildings approved prior to that date even if built after don't have to.
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      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2019
     
    Posted By: tychwarelit is required for all new builds registered for building regs purposes since 2017, buildings approved prior to that date even if built after don't have to.

    I believe they're considering changing the law so buildings will have to comply with the regs at the time they are completed rather than when they were notified. Sounds like a good idea but I imagine it would complicate things and cause some expensive last-minute changes.

    As to mandatory sprinklers, that seems like a good idea to me. With hindsight I would probably have fitted one to our house.
    • CommentAuthorJeff B
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2019
     
    <blockquote><cite>Posted By: tychwarel</cite>it is required for all new builds registered for building regs purposes since 2017, buildings approved prior to that date even if built after don't have to.</blockquote>

    Ah, that might explain it. I have no idea when the plans were approved.

    Personally I don't think it's such a marvellous idea for a bog-standard normal occupancy house. What happens if the system goes off accidentally - would the usual house insurance cover this sort of thing? I can imagine a lot of damage could be caused this way!
  1.  
    We're all used to seeing sprinklers in buildings like shops and workplaces. Has anyone ever seen one going off accidentally? They always seem pretty reliable to me, not like smoke alarms.

    If you did have a fire, apart from the life saving aspects, AIUI the sprinkler would use a lot less water to suppress the fire than the fire brigade would, and would react much quicker, so should result in less damage, so I s'pose the insurers should be glad to see it. No personal experience though.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeOct 17th 2019
     
    Posted By: WillInAberdeenthe sprinkler would use a lot less water to suppress the fire than the fire brigade
    And a mister system far less again.
    • CommentAuthorborpin
    • CommentTimeOct 25th 2019 edited
     
    Posted By: WillInAberdeenWe're all used to seeing sprinklers in buildings like shops and workplaces. Has anyone ever seen one going off accidentally?
    Pet hate of mine - films where the fire alarm sets off **all** the sprinklers.

    Sprinklers are a fail-safe system where safe is water flowing. There is a small glass vial that blocks the water flow. When the temperature increases, the liquid in the vial expands until pop and the water flows. It is possible to change the temperature the vial breaks at by changing the fluid. Therefore, only the sprinkler actually close to the fire goes off (usually).

    Posted By: Jeff BPersonally I don't think it's such a marvellous idea for a bog-standard normal occupancy house.
    There is a town in the USA that since the introduction of mandatory domestic sprinklers has not had a domestic house death, due to fire. I read about it years ago - quite extraordinary.

    You also have more chance of a flood caused by mice eating your plastic pipe which they seem to love....
    • CommentAuthorJeff B
    • CommentTimeOct 25th 2019
     
    Posted By: borpin
    Posted By: WillInAberdeenWe're all used to seeing sprinklers in buildings like shops and workplaces. Has anyone ever seen one going off accidentally?
    Pet hate of mine - films where the fire alarm sets off **all** the sprinklers.

    Sprinklers are a fail-safe system where safe is water flowing. There is a small glass vial that blocks the water flow. When the temperature increases, the liquid in the vial expands until pop and the water flows. It is possible to change the temperature the vial breaks at by changing the fluid. Therefore, only the sprinkler actually close to the fire goes off (usually).

    Posted By: Jeff BPersonally I don't think it's such a marvellous idea for a bog-standard normal occupancy house.
    There is a town in the USA that since the introduction of mandatory domestic sprinklers has not had a domestic house death, due to fire. I read about it years ago - quite extraordinary.

    You also have more chance of a flood caused by mice eating your plastic pipe which they seem to love....


    I am old school so there is only copper pipework in our house - no plastic in sight!
    • CommentAuthorrevor
    • CommentTimeOct 25th 2019
     
    A few years ago as the Welsh regs came into force I had a conversation with my BCO about the topic. He was not in favour as he said given the other fire safety regs already previously implemented, smoke alarms, means of escape loft conversion protection, fire doors etc no person in Wales had died as a result of a fire in a new property. Affordable housing in rural Wales is a big issue and the addition of sprinkler systems in small dwellings was an additional cost to all the other regs implemented over the years and justification was not there to warrant the cost of a sprinkler system.

    Time and energy would have been better spent improving the build quality of homes by spending time policing regs already in place rather than dreaming up further regulations.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeOct 26th 2019
     
    A mister system can allow waiving of some of those 'other fire safety regs', opening up creative and practical possibilities.

    For example, Bldg Insp allowed a sleeping loft upstairs from and open to a living space below which included open plan kitchen. The stair descended within the living space to the escape door at the lower level. That very relaxed spacious layout would have been impossible without the mister, which was simply a base-plate under the kitchen mixer tap, the reservoir and pressure keg housed under the sink.

    When the mister goes off, only a few litres of water fill the room with a fine mist, no more damaging to contents than an outdoor fog, and that's plenty to steal all the heat, by evaporative cooling, from any flame.

    Misters are great!
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