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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

PLEASE NOTE: A download link for Volume 1 will be sent to you by email and Volume 2 will be sent to you by post as a book.

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    • CommentAuthorbogal2
    • CommentTimeNov 18th 2019 edited
     
    Hi, just done a freedom of information act request on a new council building:

    Building area. The new building has a square meterage of1435m2 Building cost – the Build Cost, excluding external works, temporary station, design fees and Contingencies, but including building associated abnormals is£3,245,196.68 The building cost per square meter is£2,261.46. 

    Ive had a meeting with the team building behind this new firestation headquarters in Cheshirere who explained that features such as triple glazing and MVHR were too expensive, but when it comes down to the actual cost of this building which seems pretty low spec it seems to be more expensive than building a passivhaus commercial building- in my experience. Should it be acceptable for councils to build to this standard at our considerable expense?

    I enclose their building wall build-ups which seem to have 100mm celotec in the walls and 150mm on the roof.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeNov 18th 2019
     
    No
    • CommentAuthorgyrogear
    • CommentTimeNov 18th 2019 edited
     
    Posted By: bogal2The building cost per square meter is£2,261.46


    (hmm, they don't say anything about cladding or sprinklers...)

    I found this :
    https://costmodelling.com/building-costs

    Could not find a fire HQ, but an ''Office, low rise, non-air conditioned, higher specification"" = £2020 per m2.
    So at +10%, looks like the local taxpayer is getting well ripped-off...

    FWIW:
    This year the average construction cost for France is 1727 Euros = £1500 per sq. metre. "For a high-class construction add on up to 50%". "Construction representing 7 to 10% of total project cost"

    gg
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeNov 19th 2019
     
    The higher the costs the higher the fees are all round and for this is already a conflict of interests and has an outcome of driving up out turn costs.
    • CommentAuthorGreenPaddy
    • CommentTimeNov 19th 2019
     
    I think you need to be very careful comparing m2 rates, in terms of what's included...ground preparation, utility supply enabling, fees for research into mitigation of flooding/conservation areas etc, fees to local gov't for local infrastructure, what finishes included. We used to bench mark costings for the facilities we designed/built, and it takes a lot of work to compare apples with apples.

    Should gov't buildings just SCRAPE by building regs? Personally I feel they should be leading the way in driving better performance with novel approaches, to allow the rest to copy at lower costs.

    Agree with Tony - Professional services charged as a percentage of out turn costs is SO wrong. What is their motivation to work harder, more manhours, to reduce costs, if they will in turn get a lesser fee. Human nature will win out.

    Unfortunately bean counters like fixed or recognisable numbers. We had huge success utilising a very collaborative, non-confrontational construction approach, where all efforts were directed to building the best we could, rather than under-pricing with all efforts directed at looking for ways to claw back profits through re-work and "extras". Our legal eagles review to the Board was that we couldn't be effective as there was almost no litigation on our projects.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeNov 19th 2019
     
    Posted By: GreenPaddyWhat is their motivation to work harder, more manhours, to reduce cost
    In my case, to deliver good value and so get recommended for my next job - which totally out-points this apparent incentive to escalate costs.

    However that doesn't work if the consultants are on some conveyor belt that gives them the next job regardless of past VFM.
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