Home  5  Books  5  GBEzine  5  News  5  HelpDesk  5  Register  5  GreenBuilding.co.uk
Not signed in (Sign In)

Categories



Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

PLEASE NOTE: A download link for Volume 1 will be sent to you by email and Volume 2 will be sent to you by post as a book.

Buy individually or both books together. Delivery is free!


powered by Surfing Waves




Vanilla 1.0.3 is a product of Lussumo. More Information: Documentation, Community Support.

Welcome to new Forum Visitors
Join the forum now and benefit from discussions with thousands of other green building fans and discounts on Green Building Press publications: Apply now.




    • CommentAuthorSally M
    • CommentTimeNov 30th 2008
     
    Hi

    Has anyone had any experience of acoustic plaster boards compared with standard plaster board and acoustic partition roll?

    Sally
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeNov 30th 2008
     
    Double plasterboard works well, you still need rockwool but solid partitions are best.
    •  
      CommentAuthornigel
    • CommentTimeNov 30th 2008
     
    Are you trying to achieve a certain level of sound resistance?
    • CommentAuthorSally M
    • CommentTimeNov 30th 2008
     
    Hi Nigel,

    We are trying to achieve 40 decibels or less. As a supplemental, we also need to consider the acoustics between floors. Anyone got any recommendations for this?
    Tony, someone suggested using acoustic board rather than double plasterboard, as it was more cost effective....don't know what your thoughts are on this????

    Decisions, decisions decisions!!!! :confused:
    • CommentAuthorTimber
    • CommentTimeNov 30th 2008 edited
     
    Ok

    well one layer (on either side) of 15 mm plasterboard, and some mineral wool (glass will be fine) with a density of 10kg/m3 or more, on a 38 x 89 stud wall, will give you a sound reduction index (Rw) of 40dB quite easily. by the way you want 40 dB or more not less!

    As for floors, it all depends how far you want to go. 22 mm floor deck, 15 mm plasterboard and 100 mm mineral wool (same spec as above ) will give 40 dB Rw for the floors.

    Both of the above will comply with current new build Approved Document E requirements.

    In my experience (I was an acoustic consultant and sound insulation tester type person for about 5 years) solid constructions are not actually that good at stopping sound)

    If you want more then a better spec plasterboard and/or multiple layers will give a better performance. If you use two layers of board make sure they are a different thickness, i.e. one layer of 15 and one 12, or 19 mm plank and 15 mm for better performance. If you use two layers of the same spec and thickness, you will not get quite such a good performance (resonance issues).

    You don't need any special 'acoustic' stuff, just reasonable design and excecution will work just as well. Most of the acoustic stuff is just normal spec products with 'acoustic' stuck on there. I.e. 'acoustic' mastic is just flexible silicone sealant (like bath sealant) but about twice the price!

    Timber
    • CommentAuthor10100
    • CommentTimeNov 30th 2008 edited
     
    some useful info there Timber, was worth reading :)
  1.  
    Tinber, you hint that plasterboard is better than solid masonry which seems a bit contradictory when you consider the mass law. I thought sound reduction was mostly about mass- the more of it the better[for most frequencies anyway]
    • CommentAuthorTimber
    • CommentTimeNov 30th 2008
     
    Not better, but as good, perhaps i could have made that a little clearer. Masonary is good but no better generally than lightweight.

    The actual performance of the walls (in terms of performance at certain frequencies) is different, but the overall performance (in terms of single figure value) is pritty similar for a set thickness.

    Mass law is one of the fundametals of acoustics, but with layers and air gaps, simlar performances can be achieved.

    Lets take a standard timber party wall consisting of two timber frames separated by a 50 mm cavity, with mineral wool inside and one layer of 19 mm plank and one layer of 15 mm wallboard to either room face VS a solid wall consisting of 215 blocks (laid flat) plastered on either room face, the performance will be similar. With the solid wall, it is let down because there is a physical connection between both sides.

    Modern masonary walls consist of lightweight blockwork and a cavity, but the blocks are light, and don't tend to work quite so well at higher frequencies.

    Timber walls work well at high frequencies, but are let down a little at the lower end of the spectrum (a bit 'boomy').

    A good timber wall as above can exceed building regs, by 10 dB (55 dB DnT,w + Ctr vs min of 45 dB)

    A good masonary wall can hit the same value.

    Flanking sound (sound skipping round the element in question (regardless of construction type)) can play a big part too.

    Timber
    • CommentAuthorSally M
    • CommentTimeNov 30th 2008
     
    You see!!!! that's why I just love this forum!! I will do some more research now, based on what you have all said. Thanks!

    :bigsmile:
    • CommentAuthorMike George
    • CommentTimeNov 30th 2008 edited
     
    Nice explanation Timber - thanks.

    From what you've said though, I would imagine that cavity construction of twin heavyweight blockwork, rendered both sides would have the benefits of both mass and [near] structural seperation, outperforming the examples given above?

    Filling the cavity with fluffy stuff making it even better?
  2.  
    My local BCO happy with
    12.5mm standard PB with rockwool or 12.5mm acoustic PB with any mineral fibre for in between floors
    some other areas they want 15mm or Acou.PB
    • CommentAuthorTimber
    • CommentTimeNov 30th 2008
     
    Mike, yes, a heavy weight masonary cavity system can out perform the construction types mentioned above but a lot of this depends on the other elements performing well (like external walls, doors and windows).

    You can reach a certain level with walls and floors where the performance of the separating structure ends up limited by other elements.

    As a general rule of thumb though is that either you wants lots of mass or lots of separation, or a bit of both.

    Timber
    • CommentAuthorMiked2714
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2008
     
    For floors doesn't it depend if you're considering impact or airbourne noise. I guess it's the same for walls, just that internal impact noise unlikely to be an issue.

    E.g. for airbourne noise, sealing all noise paths is key. For impact noise, you can't beat an entirely separate suspended ceiling.
    • CommentAuthorTimber
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2008
     
    Mike - indeed.

    The above floor spec will be 'ok' for impact (carpets make a big difference).

    If its a masonary floor, a thin resilient layer works really really well because there is enough mass to absorb the foot fall energy, plus masonary floors won't deflect as much on impact.

    With timber there is less mass to absorb the foot fall energy and more deflection from the structure, but to get good performance it is always better to stop the impact at source, so it is better to install a floating floor of some sort. Propriatory flooring boards can be bought, but a laminate of dense mineral wool and chipboard works wonders.

    Timber
    • CommentAuthorSally M
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2008
     
    Hi Timber,

    What about concrete impregnated boards????????



    :confused:
    • CommentAuthorTimber
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2008
     
    Do you mean cement bonded particle boards?
    • CommentAuthorSally M
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2008
     
    It is called cement impregnated particle board......so I don't know, is the answer to that!
    • CommentAuthorTimber
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2008
     
    Yeah thats the same stuff.

    Its pritty good in terms of mass, but isn't quite as 'dead' as plasterboard so resonance can be an issue.

    Timber
  3.  
    and Timber, while you're at it, what about a solid concrete floor (beams, with hollow blocks dropped in, screed, marble) noisy now - going to lay solid wood flooring straight on top (marble is ugly as sin but wonderfully flat!). I have seen some thin (3mm or 6 mm) noise insulation underlay - but I guess from above you're going to tell me any old underlay will do, but in either case it won't do much:cry:

    Ta
    • CommentAuthorTimber
    • CommentTimeDec 3rd 2008
     
    A thin resilient layer (5+ mm) will make a resonable difference when stuck on top of a concrete floor. You should quite easily be able to notice a differnce.

    Essentially it doesn't have to be an 'acoustic' underlay, all they are is rubber or dense foam or both! If you can find something similar off the self at a flooring shop then it should do just as well.

    Timber
  4.  
    Thanks Timber, or should I just call you "The Noise Man"!:smile:
    • CommentAuthorTimber
    • CommentTimeDec 4th 2008
     
    :cool::wink:
Add your comments

    Username Password
  • Format comments as
 
   
The Ecobuilding Buzz
Site Map    |   Home    |   View Cart    |   Pressroom   |   Business   |   Links   
Logout    

© Green Building Press