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    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2009
     
    Ladies and Gentleman

    Just looking at Modular construction systems and the use of shipping containers in modern modular building. Just want to get everyones view on their use and whether they think it is a good idea or bad idea.

    A couple of examples for you to look at are:

    http://www.inhabitat.com/2008/08/22/travelodge-shipping-container-hotel/
    http://www.inhabitat.com/2008/12/19/prefab-friday-puma-city-container-architecture/
    http://www.containercity.com/

    What do you think? Could this be an answer to recycling shipping containers? How easy would it be to retrofit to meet building legislation? Is it worth the time and effort?
    • CommentAuthorStuartB
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2009 edited
     
    Dai - I am sure the merits of these have been discussed before. Try searching on the site.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2009
     
    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2009
     
    I would still like to hear anyones thoughts, if possible.
    • CommentAuthorTimber
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2009
     
    I was involved in a Job for a large national builder that was using a modular building system by Yorkon.

    They are essentially two shipping containers bolted toghether for each flat. They just crained in and stacked them between a steel frame making a 6 ish storey block of flats.

    They seamed to work well. Good sound insulation (that was the part that I was involved in) and super fast build, and inside where just like any other cheep new build flat, not luxury but not half bad!

    As for converting, I would wonder weather the effort of converting one/some for a one off dwelling was really worth it?!

    Timber
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2009
     
    Shipping containers are a form of over-designed house so can be used. However, by using one, you are taking it out of the second hand system (for use a as shipping container). If this means that one more has to be built, you have effectively spent a vast amount of embodied energy on the structure.

    So I doubt it's truly 'green'. In addition, they're not a good size for rooms and they are difficult to convert properly. There's another thread on this forum (somewhere) that this is discussed in more detail.
    • CommentAuthorCWatters
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2009 edited
     
    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeFeb 22nd 2009
     
    cheers for that.
    • CommentAuthorludite
    • CommentTimeFeb 22nd 2009
     
    Aren't shipping containers just made from steel? This would surely make them quite easy to recycle when they come to the end of their intended use. I think I'd prefer a wood burning stove made from recycled shipping container steel, in a well insulated and designed timber framed house.
    •  
      CommentAuthorrichy
    • CommentTimeFeb 22nd 2009
     
    Lots of footage on youtube!
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeFeb 23rd 2009
     
    "Aren't shipping containers just made from steel?"

    Yes.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeMay 28th 2009
     
    Yes they are....but once they are used what do we do with them? second hand containers are almost £10 cheaper per square meter than masonry cavity construction (both exluding insulation and plasterboard/plaster skim). So this is could be an option to one recycle a structurally sound component and two a solution to provide affordable housing....more info will become available as I write my dissertation, I will try and keep you all posted.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeMay 28th 2009
     
    <blockquote><cite>Posted By: ludite</cite>I think I'd prefer a wood burning stove made from recycled shipping container steel, in a well insulated and designed timber framed house.</blockquote>

    But the energy used to dismantle the container and cut it up to make a wood burning stove would just be contributing to the problem surely? A shipping container provides a structurally sound component, it just requires insulating and minor adjustments (ie. creating windows etc.)
    • CommentAuthorSaint
    • CommentTimeMay 28th 2009 edited
     
    Dai, have you seen these http://www.myspacepod.co.uk/
    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeMay 28th 2009
     
    Thanks Saint, I've seen similar stuff by other people who have done the same thing, I also found out that a popular university used to get architecture students to design a student room out of a container for one of their assignments.
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeMay 29th 2009
     
    "Yes they are....but once they are used what do we do with them?"

    Depends how used they are: Some can be refurbed and re-used for shipping. Others may be too degraded for shipping or there might not be shipping demand: These can be refurbed for temporary works use (such as toilets). Past that point parts can be recycled or scrapped at a relatively low environmental cost. Generally, failure is in the preformed thin wall cladding rather than the sub-system.

    Or you can take scrap steel out of the system and build effectively very over-designed houses with unusual cladding arrangements, difficult room sizes and a tendency to conduct heatloss to the worst insulated point or break

    I can't see any environmental benefit to doing this. It's a fun idea though providing it's not you that has to live in one.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeJun 16th 2009
     
    Does anyone have an idea what the Thermal conductivity of an ISO shipping container is?

    Jon from my research so far they are excellent to live in, they are also £4.50 cheaper per m2 to build with (once materials are on site, I have not looked at transporation costs) They recycle are useable component that would otherwise be left to sit unused. The problem is the west imports so such but exports so little, it is cheaper to buy the container in the East ship the goods to the West and then leave the container behind and go back to buy another and restart the cycle than it is to send the container back!
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeJun 16th 2009
     
    The thermal conductivity is exceptionally high: From a design point of view it might as well not be there except to act as a heat loss mechanism

    Good luck with the paper.
    • CommentAuthorchuckey
    • CommentTimeJun 16th 2009
     
    I second the poor thermal performance. Also as they are effectively a sealed steel box, they are essentially vapour proof so some way will have to be found to remove ANY water vapour permeating the insulation. Also the detailing around windows and doors will have to be very carefully designed and constructed to stop rain getting in and not getting out. They could have some use in mediterraneum climates but not here.
    Frank
    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeJun 17th 2009
     
    They are already used to here to a surprisingly large extent for the type of technology.

    I need the thermal conductivity to allow me to calculate the U-values, my paper is going to look at the technical side, type and location of insulation, Infiltration, ventilation etc.
    • CommentAuthorcookie
    • CommentTimeJun 17th 2009
     
    I would be sceptical of the condition of a second hand container, when they come out of use they are often buckled or rusted through.

    http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/thermal-conductivity-metals-d_858.html

    hope this helps

    Cookie
    • CommentAuthorSaint
    • CommentTimeJun 17th 2009
     
    Dai, I'm sure you appreciate that a standard ISO container is a steel box and therefore as jon and chuckey point out has an extremely poor thermal conductivity.

    If in fact you're talking ISO reefer containers then there are two classifications under the ATP standard. One normally insulated where the U value of the box has to be better than 0.7W/m2K and the other heavily insulated where is has to be better than 0.4W/m2K. The latter of these two is also the U value that refrigerated trucks involved in the transport of perishable goods has to achieve.

    Its worth noting though that the thermal performance of these containers and indeed some trucks worsens dramatically with age as damage to the outer skins allows moisture to penetrate the foam. This is more prevalent in containers that are insulated with injected PUR foam whereas many trucks now use XPS
    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeSep 11th 2009
     
    Dissertation done and dusted!!!!
    •  
      CommentAuthorDAI_EVANS
    • CommentTimeSep 11th 2009
     
    Thank you everyone for your input! It was very much appreciated
  1.  
    Hi, guys, I am working on modular container hotel and student accommodation project in London , and the house for Belgium.

    First of all, container is not just normal steel, it is Corten Steel, which is much much higer quality than normal UB or UC (S275). The container's designed lifetime is 10 years on duty during sea shipping. People can image how bad the weather condition is.

    The modular container house can be made (with my experience) max 3600mm(W) x 40' (45') (L) x 3600(H). All the modules less than that can be easily made. And it is easily to be shipped with a shipping permit certification.

    Insulation Question:
    Material Thermal Conductivity
    (1) Rockwool CSR Fibertex B50~60 λ=0.031-0.034
    (2) Plaster board Knauf 12.5mm fire proof λ=0.16-0.24
    (3) Glass λ=0.75-1
    (4) Plywood λ=0.125-0.17
    (5) Solid wood λ=0.08-0.1
    (6) Cor-ten Steel λ=50
    (7) Galv.Sheet Steel λ=50
    (8) Air λ=0.024


    The European Standard of “U” value is as following:
    EU wall<= 0.45m2.k/w Our wall 0.3085 m2.k/w (2 container putting each other)
    EU roof<=0.25m2.k/w Our roof 0.22 m2.k/w (Kingspan Roofing)
    EU floor<=0.45m2.k/w Our floor 0.26 m2.k/w
    EU window<=3.3m2.k/w Our window 2.51 m2.k/w
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeSep 23rd 2009
     
    True, it's an alloy with self sealing properties but these become irrelevant if you paint it: The design of this steel is for shipping so allowing rust to form as a protective barrier (when alloyed) is a good idea. Not so sure that allowing rust to form on internal structures is a design criteria that one would typically choose: Generally for internal domestic structures you would seek to completely prevent internal rusting and so these particular qualities (of the cor-ten steel) become a bit irrelevant don't they?
    • CommentAuthorCWatters
    • CommentTimeSep 23rd 2009 edited
     
    Posted By: agson.engineers
    The European Standard of “U” value is as following:
    EU wall<= 0.45m2.k/w Our wall 0.62 m2.k/w
    EU roof<=0.25m2.k/w Our roof 0.36 m2.k/w
    EU floor<=0.45m2.k/w Our floor 0.26 m2.k/w
    EU window<=3.3m2.k/w Our window 2.51 m2.k/w


    Something wrong with your units there and/or or you don't meet the EU standard?
  2.  
    Hi CWatters,

    Normally, we have kingspan for facade with PUR core. and the wall, when we put container each other, U value should be counted by 2 walls, not only one, so the wall U value will be less than 0.4m2.k/w. For the roof, same story as facade, we are going to put flat roof system of kingspan, which is much lower U value than EU standard.
    • CommentAuthorjamesingram
    • CommentTimeSep 23rd 2009 edited
     
    I think the confusion may be 'U' values in the UK and US are work out and expressed in a different way ?
  3.  
    Hi Jon

    Painting
    Surface protection
    Surface preparation
    (1)Before and after the final moulding, all panels are to be impeller blasting treated and meet Swedish standard SA 2 1/2 (approaching to a white metal surface). Roughness of the bottom surface is 25~35µm, and remove all rust, dirt, rolling oxidative skins and other exotic stuffs.
    (2)All door fittings are warm-plated with Zinic, and the coating thickness is 70µm.
    (3)All fastening fittings such as tapping screw, screw cap, hinge, lock protruding wheel, bonding fittings, fillet are all Zinic-plated. The coating thickness is 130µm.

    Bottom paint coating
    Before assembly
    The surface of all steel sheets is painted with 2 layers, 10-150µm-thick Epoxy zinc rich primer after the impeller blasting treatment. Then the steel sheet will be immediately moved to the drying room for drying.
    Post-assembly
    (1)All welding gaps are impeller blasting treated to remove welding dregs, splashed welding balls and burned coating resultant from welding.
    (2)The assembled containers should be surface-painted with two layers of Epoxy zinc rich primer.
    (3)Thickness of dry film of the primer paint should be 35~40µm (including the first layer of primer) on the exterior surface and pedestal of the containers, whereas, it is 25~30µm for the interior surface.
    Surface paint
    When the Epoxy zinc rich primer dries, the surface of all containers are to be painted with high-powered chlorinated rubber top-coat.

    bottom paint
    After the sheet-spreading work is done, all pedestal and floor are to be daubed with 200µm-thick bottom-sealed bitumastic paint whose main component is asbestos/bitumen.
    Exterior surface: 100~110 µm
    Interior surface: 50~ 60 µm
    pedestal: 235~340 µm
    Bottom surface of the bottom plate: 200 µm (minimum)
   
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