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General: Keyhole Airtightness

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61 to 90 of 104

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    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeFeb 23rd 2012 edited
     
    Receiver in the saddle? RFID implanted sub-dermally? If it was voice activated, would that mean you'd be talking through your......! :shocked:
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeFeb 23rd 2012
     
    Could just swallow one and after a while you can ride your bike.

    Now who is ready for the Army joke about the boys in the desert using the camel when they need relief:wink:
    •  
      CommentAuthorjoe90
    • CommentTimeFeb 23rd 2012
     
    My brother-in-law bought a new Bentley a few years ago with "no key" door locks and ignition and a proximity key fob, his first trip out in it was to a school open evening but because he was late had to park out in the street, half way through the evening he asked his wife where she had put her key fob for the car "in the glovebox" was the reply :shamed:
    • CommentAuthorSeret
    • CommentTimeFeb 23rd 2012
     
    I just put a wee piece of sticky tape over the side that doesn't get used. Change it when it falls off. Job done.
    • CommentAuthorGaryB
    • CommentTimeFeb 23rd 2012
     
    I'm with Seret on this one. Also we use a security bolt for internal door locking rather than a key.
    •  
      CommentAuthorjoe90
    • CommentTimeFeb 23rd 2012
     
    I thought Euro locks got over this problem as there is no hole all the way through, similarly "yale" type door locks have no through hole like lever locks,

    Saw report this week about a spate of breakins where Euro locks were quite easily "snapped"
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-17075027
    •  
      CommentAuthorJSHarris
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012 edited
     
    <blockquote><cite>Posted By: joe90</cite>My brother-in-law bought a new Bentley a few years ago with "no key" door locks and ignition and a proximity key fob, his first trip out in it was to a school open evening but because he was late had to park out in the street, half way through the evening he asked his wife where she had put her key fob for the car "in the glovebox" was the reply</blockquote>

    My car has the same system - no keys or ignition, just a fob that needs to be within a few feet of the car to make it work. It does warn you if you leave the spare fob inside the car though, by beeping at you quite loudly as you walk away (in fact the blasted thing seems to delight in beeping at you at any opportunity, probably one of its least endearing qualities).

    I've always thought the same system would be a good option for a house (minus all the beeps).
    • CommentAuthorCav8andrew
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012 edited
     
    Joe, was going to post re. the ability to snap euro locks, they can also be bumped, plenty on downloads on the internet on how to do it, supposedly posted by professional locksmiths. The problem lies in having a section of the barrel standing proud of the door or accessible once lever plate is removed, attach molegrips and away you go! There are euro locks which are supposedly bump and snap proof and if I can find the manufactures will post. Off the top of my head Assa and Abloy are possibly ok. I suspect as with all locks they are defeatable but will resist far longer than snap and turn.
    •  
      CommentAuthorJSHarris
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    <blockquote><cite>Posted By: Cav8andrew</cite>Joe, was going to post re. the ability to snap euro locks, they can also be bumped, plenty on downloads on the internet on how to do it, supposedly posted by professional locksmiths. The problem lies in having a section of the barrel standing proud of the door or accessible once lever plate is removed, attach molegrips and away you go! There are euro locks which are supposedly bump and snap proof and if I can find the manufactures will post. Off the top of my head Assa and Abloy are possibly ok. I suspect as with all locks they are defeatable but will resist far longer than snap and turn.</blockquote>

    Thanks for this tip. I've just checked mine and they are Euro locks that stick out enough to be snapped fairly easily. I'm off now to see if I can get a couple of replacements..............:sad:
    • CommentAuthorCav8andrew
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    JSH. You can also buy retro fit plates with concealed fixings which sheath the protruding section of barrel. Not sure of cost or practicality in your situation but might be worth asking about. I think there is a Yale barrel which is certified snap/bump proof (within limits).
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    Thought everyone knew about the security aspect of eurolocks, been known about for years...

    http://antony-christie.wrytestuff.com/swa49197.htm

    The higher (it's all relative) security types are readily available and not at all expensive. E.g... http://www.locksmart-uk.com/locks.html

    And for balance... http://www.handlestore.com/category/Cylinder-Door-Locks/0/
    • CommentAuthorskyewright
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    Posted By: SeretI just put a wee piece of sticky tape over the side that doesn't get used. Change it when it falls off. Job done.

    Or a smear of petroleum jelly.

    PS. Remember to 'exercise' the lock from both sides every now and again. I try to remember to do that at least once a year. Perhaps more important in our coastal climate?
    •  
      CommentAuthorJSHarris
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    <blockquote><cite>Posted By: Joiner</cite>Thought everyone knew about the security aspect of eurolocks, been known about for years...

    <a rel="nofollow" href="http://antony-christie.wrytestuff.com/swa49197.htm">http://antony-christie.wrytestuff.com/swa49197.htm</a>

    The higher (it's all relative) security types are readily available and not at all expensive. E.g...<a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.locksmart-uk.com/locks.html">http://www.locksmart-uk.com/locks.html</a>

    And for balance...<a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.handlestore.com/category/Cylinder-Door-Locks/0/">http://www.handlestore.com/category/Cylinder-Door-Locks/0/</a></blockquote>

    For some reason, I'd not heard of the issue with Euro locks, and I do still get the local Neighbourhood Watch newsletter. What's more annoying is that the locks (and doors) in question were only fitted about 4 or 5 years ago, so after that blog you linked to, and having just taken one out to measure it up for replacement I've found out it's a typical (and rather vulnerable) type. The local lock place has some snap and bump-proof ones the right size, so I'm off later to get a couple (at over £40 each............).
    • CommentAuthorSeret
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    Posted By: skyewright
    Or a smear of petroleum jelly.


    Could do, but I tend to keep oil-based gunk away from locks. It just attracts dirt.
    • CommentAuthorCav8andrew
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    JSH, From what I understand these vulnerable styles are still being fitted in large volume, so don't feel too bad. I looked at barrels at over £100 each then searched for info on them on the web, only to discover a demonstration of a conical, hardened tip, drill attachment that whipped the barrel out in no time flat. At which point I gave up. I suspect at £40 each you have gone for a sensible price point.
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    I genuinely thought it was common knowledge and that, after all the earlier publicity (mind you, I was working in the upvc trade at that time), the crap locks had stopped being sold, let alone fitted.

    Ah well, at least this thread has meant that those on here are now aware.

    Still amazed that BS hasn't withdrawn the standard mark from the bad ones though.
    • CommentAuthorskyewright
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    Posted By: Seret
    Posted By: skyewright
    Or a smear of petroleum jelly.

    Could do, but I tend to keep oil-based gunk away from locks. It just attracts dirt.

    Inside yes, but outside on an exposed aspect (which is where I use it) a smear of PJ lasts a great deal longer than a piece of tape would.
    • CommentAuthorSeret
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    Posted By: skyewright
    Inside yes, but outside on an exposed aspect (which is where I use it) a smear of PJ lasts a great deal longer than a piece of tape would.


    For sure. Tape seems to last a couple of years, which is good enough for me.
    •  
      CommentAuthorJSHarris
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    <blockquote><cite>Posted By: Joiner</cite>I genuinely thought it was common knowledge and that, after all the earlier publicity (mind you, I was working in the upvc trade at that time), the crap locks had stopped being sold, let alone fitted.

    Ah well, at least this thread has meant that those on here are now aware.

    Still amazed that BS hasn't withdrawn the standard mark from the bad ones though.</blockquote>

    Yes, thanks to all for the awareness of this problem, even if it was a bit tangential to the theme of this thread. The locks in question are decent looking 7 tumbler ones, but have the centre weakness that makes them very vulnerable to snapping. What's worse is that they are actually too long for the doors, I've now learned, so protrude on the outside of the handle plate by about 10mm when they should be flush, making it easier to get a mole wrench on and rip the things out in seconds. They are Kite marked, too.
  20.  
    If you are buying a number of replacement locks Jeremy, get them all on the same key. That's the norm here in Sweden same key opens all outside doors, garden shed etc. makes for a lot less fumbling around. OK it may leave you more vulnerable in the event you lose a key, but most times you'd be losing the bunch anyway.
    • CommentAuthorCav8andrew
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    The double wammy with a lock that can be bumped is that there is no visible sign of forced entry. So having been robbed your insurance company may well not pay out!
    •  
      CommentAuthorJSHarris
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    <blockquote><cite>Posted By: Cav8andrew</cite>The double wammy with a lock that can be bumped is that there is no visible sign of forced entry. So having been robbed your insurance company may well not pay out!</blockquote>

    Well, I now have two new locks fitted, that are anti-bump, anti-snap and anti-pick, apparently, and my wallet is nearly £100 lighter. I opted to pay a bit more and have them on the same key, too, although I'm not sure why that costs an extra £5.

    The interesting thing was that the vast majority of Euro locks in the shop were all the vulnerable type, they only stocked a small range of anti-snap/anti-bump locks and I was lucky that the proper size of lock for my doors is actually a common one (what's odd is that the size that was fitted before was an uncommon one).

    FWIW, the usual hardware/DIY sheds don't stock ANY anti-snap locks, and Screwfix only stock a very limited range. It seems that unless you go out of your way to look for secure Euro locks then you'll end up with the ones that can be broken into in a couple of seconds.
    • CommentAuthorCav8andrew
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    thanks JSH, your comments echo my experience in respect of the availability of a barrel that would resist anything other than a cursory attack.
    • CommentAuthorEd Davies
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    Why does the expression "fitness for intended purpose" float into my mind?
    •  
      CommentAuthorDamonHD
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012
     
    I just wrote to the installer of my (latest) two exterior 2G doors with that in my mind too.

    (Though only in one is the door actually accessible from outside, by design, though the wind sill manages to blow through the other one's lock...)

    Rgds

    Damon
    • CommentAuthorwookey
    • CommentTimeFeb 25th 2012 edited
     
    I've got cisa Astral S on my GBF door which claim to be snap-proof and dump-resistant. I've put the same (well cisa astral because I couldn't find Astral-S in single-sided form) on the new garage door (single-sided form is snap-proof anyway). The Greensteps doors came with something else (they couldn't supply matching Astral-S, tiresomely). I don't know how to find out how vulnerable they are.

    I like eurolocks - it's a neat design, and the interchangeability is great, but the weakness in the middle is an issue, and I've not seen anyone manage to make one with a thermal break in it yet. I guess it's hard to do that and keep them strong, on the other hand a deliberate weak-point seems to be the approach some manufacturers are taking to the snapping problem anyway, so that would be ideal.

    If one went for electronic locks (I refuse to pay that much!) what happens when their batts go flat?
    • CommentAuthorpmagowan
    • CommentTimeFeb 25th 2012
     
    I believe they warn you in advance and there is usually a master key.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDamonHD
    • CommentTimeMar 12th 2012
     
    Just had out glazing people round to (a) reinforce with a shroud the front-door lock which may have been vulnerable to 'bumping' (it's anti-drill already I think) and (b) deal with residual leakiness (oodles of silicone sealant) in our patio-door locks even though the barrel is not exposed to the outside.

    I can put up a pic of the latter if anyone is interested.

    Rgds

    Damon
    • CommentAuthorSteveZ
    • CommentTimeMar 12th 2012
     
    Thanks to all for pointing out the weakness in a eurolock - I have just checked our patio doors and the locks are flush with the surface, so good for my DG company :smile:

    On the original topic, deadlock keyholes. What is wrong with an escutcheon plate and pivoted cover over the keyhole? I used to fit them years ago, mainly as a decorative feature, but they will keep most of the draught out. I have no idea where or even if you can still buy them, but they are easy enough to make.
    • CommentAuthorCav8andrew
    • CommentTimeMar 12th 2012
     
    Could you back the plate with a material to increase the draft proof qualities even more. Or perhaps make a custom airtight cover plate ?

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