Sun, 17 May 2026 01:43:34 +0100 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/ Lussumo Vanilla 1.0.3 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123791#Comment_123791 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123791#Comment_123791 Thu, 24 Nov 2011 13:30:28 +0000 SteamyTea ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123798#Comment_123798 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123798#Comment_123798 Thu, 24 Nov 2011 14:13:39 +0000 djh ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123801#Comment_123801 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123801#Comment_123801 Thu, 24 Nov 2011 14:29:47 +0000 topher
Best regards from a cloudy but temperate France (10 ºC outside),............Topher

PS. How do you know when someone has put a new entry? It is a pain looking at it each day.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123802#Comment_123802 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123802#Comment_123802 Thu, 24 Nov 2011 14:33:49 +0000 DamonHD
Rgds

Damon

PS. For me, all newly-updated threads float to the top when using this URL: http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/forum114/]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123804#Comment_123804 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123804#Comment_123804 Thu, 24 Nov 2011 14:35:36 +0000 Paul in Montreal
Cheers,

Paul in Montreal.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123821#Comment_123821 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123821#Comment_123821 Thu, 24 Nov 2011 16:14:51 +0000 topher
Regards,............Topher.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123824#Comment_123824 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123824#Comment_123824 Thu, 24 Nov 2011 16:26:47 +0000 Paul in Montreal Posted By: topherPaul, Thanks. Have you checked the filter in your primary circuit - if you have one? Nope, there's no filter as far as I'm aware. The installation using a "flush cart" was supposed to remove all the debris. So far in the 7 heating seasons (including the current one) the system has been in operation we've had one airlock that caused a dramatic loss of output and a "low refrigerant" alarm. The alarm was due to low pressure in the gas circuit due to restricted flow in the primary water circuit - basically no heat to evaporate the refrigerant and so the system thought it had escaped. The airlock was removed and everything returned to normal. I asked if there should be a pressure regulator but was told it was not necessary for the length of loop we have. Apparently it can take a few years for all the air to work itself out - especially as the pressures change between heating and cooling modes. There is an air bleed valve on the pumping module which I check every few weeks and there have been no problems since.

Paul in Montreal.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123947#Comment_123947 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=123947#Comment_123947 Fri, 25 Nov 2011 22:02:35 +0000 Sprocket Interesting to hear from Paul also about the kind of things that might happen. It's all sounding a bit less "Zanussi" ("Appliance of Science") and more like an old motorbike from the tinkering perspective. At least they don't leak oil (like our previous NEW oil fired boiler did in my office!).
Please keep the updates coming.

IF I do have a filter then I'm not aware of it. I thought the whole system was pretty much sealed.

Our second heat pump (a 12kW, vs the first 4kW that has been running a few months now) will be installed in a few weeks time.

Where is your filter and what does it look like?]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124063#Comment_124063 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124063#Comment_124063 Sun, 27 Nov 2011 11:42:14 +0000 topher
Here is a picture of the valve and filter. It is in the flow circuit to the heat pump, so it protects the heat exchanger in the heat pump from debris in the primary circuit - things that get in during the installation like jointing compound. If you close the valve and undo the hex cover it exposes the filter. It is held in place with a cir-clip.

The closed valve stops all the expensive anti-freeze mixture coming out. When the filter is clean and replaced, and the hex cover re-fitted, the valve is opened again. A small amount of air is rapidly removed by the automatic air vents and everything is fine.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124064#Comment_124064 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124064#Comment_124064 Sun, 27 Nov 2011 11:50:31 +0000 topher
I can only do one picture at a time. Here is the filter that I took out. You can see that it is partly blocked.

It is now clean of course!

Regards,..............Topher]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124067#Comment_124067 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124067#Comment_124067 Sun, 27 Nov 2011 12:28:40 +0000 Nick Parsons https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124087#Comment_124087 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124087#Comment_124087 Sun, 27 Nov 2011 18:52:52 +0000 SteamyTea https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124110#Comment_124110 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124110#Comment_124110 Sun, 27 Nov 2011 21:46:43 +0000 Davipon https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124111#Comment_124111 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124111#Comment_124111 Sun, 27 Nov 2011 21:48:41 +0000 SteamyTea https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124112#Comment_124112 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124112#Comment_124112 Sun, 27 Nov 2011 21:55:52 +0000 DamonHD https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124147#Comment_124147 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124147#Comment_124147 Mon, 28 Nov 2011 10:04:07 +0000 topher
The first time I cleaned the filter, about a year ago, I put the debris in a saucer. I could see bits of fibre from the hemp used to seal the screwed joints and slivers of black plastic - the pipes are made of black plastic. When I showed them in just a mildly accusatory way to the installer, he said the plastic did not come from him. He showed me the special cutter used on the pipe and it seemed to make the cut very cleanly. Perhaps the company that made the dual 120 meter pipe lengths with a U bend did it. I do have 4 of them, all connected in parallel.

If I find any magnetic particles in future, I guess they must come from the circulating pump.

Today is a white Tempo Tariff day in France. Electricity costs 58% per unit more than the price of the cheapest blue day, but the heating is still cheaper than outrageously expensive propane that I was using before the heat pump.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124983#Comment_124983 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=124983#Comment_124983 Sat, 03 Dec 2011 14:51:49 +0000 topher
I am slightly embarrassed to write this, very nerdy, but it may be of interest.

I have calculated the cost of the last two space weeks heating using French nuclear electricity. The inside temperature has been between 19 and 20ËšC, the mild outside between 6 and 13ËšC. The heated floor area is 193 sq. meters, the volume 528 cu. meters. I have allowed for the three white days (more expensive) and the standing charge. Errors could be caused by my maths, the Kw/h meter and temperature measurement errors. I believe the figure is likely to be on the high side because I have assumed even consumption during the 24 hours, however it is colder at night, therefore the compressor will run more, but the off peak price of electricity is lower at night.

I get 12.79 €, or £10.98 for 14 days
Or 91 euro centimes per day, or 78 pence per day.

I think this is pretty good. What do you think?

Regards,..........Topher.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125022#Comment_125022 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125022#Comment_125022 Sun, 04 Dec 2011 09:51:39 +0000 DamonHD
Rgds

Damon]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125025#Comment_125025 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125025#Comment_125025 Sun, 04 Dec 2011 10:33:25 +0000 topher
That surprises me. If I am truly getting a COP of 4.0, for every 1 Kw I put in, I get 4 Kw out. The average cost per Kw for the period was 0.06938 Euros or 0.05945 Pounds Sterling. If I divide these numbers by 4 to get the cost per Kw, the costs become 0.01735 € or £0.01486 per Kw. I have factored in the standing charge.

Maybe it would be easier to compare the cost of a Kw - you wont have to take your socks off! How much do you pay for a Kw coming from the hot water in your radiators, that would include the boiler efficiency?

Regards,.............Topher.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125030#Comment_125030 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125030#Comment_125030 Sun, 04 Dec 2011 11:18:47 +0000 Ed Davies Posted By: topherThe average cost per Kw for the period was 0.06938 Euro...

kWh (or if you're being really precious, kW·h).]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125033#Comment_125033 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125033#Comment_125033 Sun, 04 Dec 2011 11:45:16 +0000 topher Apologies.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125038#Comment_125038 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125038#Comment_125038 Sun, 04 Dec 2011 13:49:51 +0000 DamonHD
But we only used ~7kWh/day (12kWh/day including DHW and cooking) for Nov, so 35p per day, weighted more towards the end of the Month as things got colder, but anyhow about 35p/day for 76m^2 heated floor area. So comparable still I think.

Rgds

Damon

PS. imeasure tells me that our total gas costs have been ~£4 per week for the last couple of weeks.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125039#Comment_125039 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125039#Comment_125039 Sun, 04 Dec 2011 14:36:44 +0000 topher
Since our dwellings are totally different in size, insulation and so on, I guess maybe all we can do is compare cost of basic energy that goes into the rooms to heat them.

You pay about £0.05 per kW-h. I pay about £0.01486. A ratio of 3.36. Of course the ratio would be the other way round if we compared capital costs!

Regards,............Topher.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125045#Comment_125045 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125045#Comment_125045 Sun, 04 Dec 2011 15:49:40 +0000 DamonHD
Rgds

Damon]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125062#Comment_125062 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125062#Comment_125062 Sun, 04 Dec 2011 16:59:53 +0000 topher
What about outside temperature, I don't have accurate records of that.

Amicalement,........Topher.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125070#Comment_125070 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=125070#Comment_125070 Sun, 04 Dec 2011 17:36:57 +0000 DamonHD
2) Yes.

3) HDD = Heating Degree Days, eg see degreedays.net which has some good explanatory text. I take a base temperature of 12C since it seems to fit our actual data better than the standard 15.5C, and that's what I'm using for our local school for the same reason.

4) Usual way to get decent external temperatures without actually measuring them yourself is to find your nearest airport (or reliable weather station) and use those: for us LHR / EGLL / Heathrow fits the bill.

Rgds

Damon]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=127162#Comment_127162 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=127162#Comment_127162 Tue, 20 Dec 2011 12:49:31 +0000 gustyturbine
My feet are lovely and warm and all is good in the world, as long as the world is my 4 walls!
DHW 52 deg, UFH temp set to 40 deg maximum (rads upstairs). Hp set to level 4 from a possible 10. Now I need to play with it and learn the best set up for my property and how we use it.
I wish though I had gone for UFH upstairs.
Never mind, maybe next time, WHOOOOOOP WHOOOOOOP,
Gusty.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=127166#Comment_127166 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=127166#Comment_127166 Tue, 20 Dec 2011 13:15:18 +0000 SteamyTea ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=127168#Comment_127168 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=127168#Comment_127168 Tue, 20 Dec 2011 13:18:31 +0000 DamonHD
Rgds

Damon]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=127169#Comment_127169 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6164&Focus=127169#Comment_127169 Tue, 20 Dec 2011 13:21:46 +0000 SteamyTea ]]>