Fri, 05 Jun 2026 17:52:03 +0100 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/ Lussumo Vanilla 1.0.3 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102254#Comment_102254 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102254#Comment_102254 Sat, 12 Feb 2011 22:03:19 +0000 SteamyTea 2 I agree with, but that does not exclude other sequestration methods, natural or man made.
3 I think you know I agree with this, not totally 100% simply because the paper was showing options not realities.
4 It was a discussion paper wasn't it, and they have certainly caused that and polarisation, but I suspect that most people's views were polarised anyway.

I spent a fair slice of yesterday downloading a load of papers on this subject and it seems the deep one delves the much more complicated it all gets. It really is much more complicated than simply burning something that grows back.
Have you measured the square metreage of your hedge and estimated how much you harvest every year? yet? Would be interesting to have some primary data to work with.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102281#Comment_102281 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102281#Comment_102281 Sun, 13 Feb 2011 10:14:04 +0000 Joiner https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102352#Comment_102352 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102352#Comment_102352 Sun, 13 Feb 2011 20:53:41 +0000 Brianwilson Item 2 - I agree not all wood can be used in building but my concern is the biomass plant operators confirm they are diverting timber from re-use and recycling , claiming it saves transport. The reality is it starves panel manufacturers and others of feedstock needed to sustain their business. The biomass combustion plants are low, 15% efficiency processes and producing pollution hundreds of times higher than alternative power sources.
Item 3 is very emotive and open to wide interpretation as detailed elsewhere.
Item 4 My prime concern is our failure to apply joined up thinking and due diligence in UK in order to make best use of the resource and minimise impact . I am with John that BAT is being applied elsewhere but not in UK creating wastage and increased impact.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102411#Comment_102411 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102411#Comment_102411 Mon, 14 Feb 2011 12:14:31 +0000 sune But yes I think we both agree that there are issues at the bigger end of things. 15% is rubbish. Even the most basic stove will get you over 60%.....most now resting between 70 and 80 and climbing.
Better planning and management would also be a very sensible idea.
I think we are in broad agreement?]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102532#Comment_102532 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102532#Comment_102532 Tue, 15 Feb 2011 11:55:02 +0000 renewablejohn https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102535#Comment_102535 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102535#Comment_102535 Tue, 15 Feb 2011 12:14:44 +0000 Brianwilson Your recommendation for improved emissions control sadly appears to be ignored by Regulatory Authorities with largest plant at Port Talbot being allowed to increase emissions levels above current limits. The plant location will ensure maximum impact on UK with prevailing winds carrying pollution to all points East especially within 200km of site. ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102572#Comment_102572 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102572#Comment_102572 Tue, 15 Feb 2011 16:37:01 +0000 renewablejohn
I mentioned the Buggenum gasifier on another thread. You may be interested in the NOx levels of this plant running on Natural Gas and Coal Gas/Biomass. Not quite the result you would expect.

Graph of the results in this report

http://www.iea-coal.org.uk/publishor/system/component_view.asp?LogDocid=81307&PhyDocid=5696

I cannot seem to set up as a link

This is an old plant in generating terms so will be interesting to see the performance of their new plant when it comes on stream in 2011]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102590#Comment_102590 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102590#Comment_102590 Tue, 15 Feb 2011 19:20:16 +0000 SteamyTea You need a user name and log in to view that document

To make a hyperlink on here make sure the 'Format Comment As' option is set to 'Text']]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102596#Comment_102596 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=102596#Comment_102596 Tue, 15 Feb 2011 20:21:32 +0000 renewablejohn Posted By: SteamyTeaJohn
You need a user name and log in to view that document

To make a hyperlink on here make sure the 'Format Comment As' option is set to 'Text'

SteamyTea

Thanks for that. I new I had made an error but did not spot it at the time. I have now gone back and the link is working]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107541#Comment_107541 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107541#Comment_107541 Tue, 12 Apr 2011 15:08:32 +0100 SteamyTea http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/04/110412065945.htm?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+sciencedaily+%28ScienceDaily%3A+Latest+Science+News%29&utm_content=Google+UK]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107564#Comment_107564 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107564#Comment_107564 Tue, 12 Apr 2011 16:18:10 +0100 Joiner
Can't understand why it's only recently come to light, given the sensitivity of monitoring equipment. Surely it was picked up years ago? Did someone dismiss the data as outside the model?]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107568#Comment_107568 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107568#Comment_107568 Tue, 12 Apr 2011 16:26:35 +0100 Brianwilson http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/business/business-news/drax_to_step_up_biomass_policy_after_180m_tax_relief_windfall_1_3256426
Depending on ability to extract additional monies from taxpayer and consumer Drax detail intention to massively expand current biomass burning from current co-firing 904,000 tonnes/yr to total use of biomass at Drax power plant to replace coal plus additional 299MW dedicated biomass projects.in the Region This is estimated to require 40 million tonnes of biomass to be burned each year. The bulk will need be imported and we know this means fuel transport GHG emissions increase by a factor of 63. , Gov intend financial incentive to farmers to convert 350,000 ha from food to dedicated bio energy/biomass but this will only provide small fraction of needs.
The UK’s Biomass Energy Development Path http://pubs.iied.org/pdfs/G02921.pdf provides interesting info.
The Drax change to biomass will automatically bring 5 times increase in fuel volume , they claim it to be clean energy so why are they sizing the additional plants just below threshold for more stringent emissions regs. They state intention to burn wood waste diverting it from landfill but this surely involves WID compliance and we know existing WID compliant wood waste to energy plants create hazardous air pollution 260 times higher than equivalent gas.
These plans will have massive impact on biomass sector in UK and alternative use for valuable resource. Reference production of NOX pollution current biomass to energy projects detail NOX burden many times higher than equivalent gas per unit of useful energy produced .
It is hoped serious scrutiny wil be applied to impact of these massive biomass burning proposals.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107569#Comment_107569 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107569#Comment_107569 Tue, 12 Apr 2011 16:50:03 +0100 Joiner
What surprised me, given John's oft-repeated mantra of filtration and the European's strict adherence to tighter, higher standards, is the lack of distinction between good and bad practice. Even allowing for MacKay's repeated emphasis that his is a "cartoon Britain", I'd have thought emissions were too big an issue to disregard for simplicity's sake.

http://www.withouthotair.com/about.html]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107578#Comment_107578 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107578#Comment_107578 Tue, 12 Apr 2011 18:01:09 +0100 Brianwilson EFW plants also produce fine particles and dioxins . There are processes for producing energy from waste that do not create this pollution. Where is due diligence and duty of care?]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107585#Comment_107585 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107585#Comment_107585 Tue, 12 Apr 2011 21:53:58 +0100 SteamyTea Posted By: JoinerDid someone dismiss the data as outside the model?
Just a guess here, but nitrogen has not been trendy for a while, no laughing matter, unless combined with the right amount of oxygen at high temperature ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107613#Comment_107613 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107613#Comment_107613 Wed, 13 Apr 2011 10:04:40 +0100 SteamyTea http://www.nuffieldbioethics.org/topic/biofuels]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107626#Comment_107626 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107626#Comment_107626 Wed, 13 Apr 2011 13:05:18 +0100 Joiner https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107632#Comment_107632 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107632#Comment_107632 Wed, 13 Apr 2011 14:18:07 +0100 Brianwilson https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107633#Comment_107633 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107633#Comment_107633 Wed, 13 Apr 2011 14:37:34 +0100 Brianwilson http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/at-a-glance/main-section/green_transport_policies_may_be_harmful_1_3279914
Above is link to YP article today, thought 5 conditions for biofuel production detailed in penultimate paragraph especially interesting.
Hoping there will be serious impact scrutiny by our administration before committing further £billions into processes that will guarantee reduction in UK air quality with health repecussions plus food production problems and diversion of valuable resources.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107637#Comment_107637 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107637#Comment_107637 Wed, 13 Apr 2011 15:40:38 +0100 Joiner ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107683#Comment_107683 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107683#Comment_107683 Thu, 14 Apr 2011 09:19:12 +0100 Brianwilson I note a number of coal fired plants are now moving to biomass but the data causes concern, Tilbury detail output of 1050 MW but state biomass feedstock requirement at only 2.3m tonnes. The standard requirement detailed for 299 MW biomass plant 2.4 m tonnes. Biofuelwatch detail 299MW plant will require in excess of 1 million ha to provide feedstock.
The Gov. confirm using biomass combustion to provide energy will add £billions to NHS costs, we will all be within impact area for air quality degradation with possible exception of Steamy T. Studies in other Countries conclude that biomass produces more CO2 than coal over energy life cycle.
Can anyone explain why we are to be forced to pump extra £billions into the energy providers pockets to provide the by far dirtiest renewable energy when there are truly clean alternatives?]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107712#Comment_107712 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107712#Comment_107712 Thu, 14 Apr 2011 13:24:18 +0100 tony
Unfortunately the government has bought into this aided by the media without thinking properly -- it isn't even sustainable either!]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107715#Comment_107715 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107715#Comment_107715 Thu, 14 Apr 2011 14:27:10 +0100 Joiner https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107718#Comment_107718 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107718#Comment_107718 Thu, 14 Apr 2011 14:35:20 +0100 SteamyTea Posted By: JoinerMore like a supermarket trolley released at the top of a hill
Great fun if your on it though.
Just about to pour gravy on my train ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107725#Comment_107725 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107725#Comment_107725 Thu, 14 Apr 2011 15:02:09 +0100 Joiner
I didn't want to have the awkward silence if I'd asked the question so kept it bland! ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107729#Comment_107729 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107729#Comment_107729 Thu, 14 Apr 2011 15:37:02 +0100 Brianwilson http://www.eric-group.co.uk/news_story.php?content_id=215
UK Gov already pleading for special dispensation to avoid EU prosecution on air quality failures whilst deliberately endorsing processes that add to problems. Above article interesting.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107730#Comment_107730 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107730#Comment_107730 Thu, 14 Apr 2011 15:38:36 +0100 SteamyTea https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107734#Comment_107734 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=107734#Comment_107734 Thu, 14 Apr 2011 15:49:12 +0100 Joiner
Let that one go because the event was about POE methodology and purpose rather than actual, specific, system performance data-collection, analysis and interpretation along the lines of yours and Damon's activities.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=110184#Comment_110184 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=110184#Comment_110184 Thu, 26 May 2011 08:39:12 +0100 Brianwilson http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/business/business-news/drax_chief_awaits_biomass_verdict_for_renewable_future_1_3416576
Sadly article fails to address reality of sourcing millions of tonnes of biomass across the World or pollution impact of additional 3 no. 300MW biomass plants proposed by Drax when compared with alternatives . The Gov confirm use of biomass to provide energy will add £billions to NHS costs, DECC insist we must go down this road to achieve renewables commitment. ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=110188#Comment_110188 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6241&Focus=110188#Comment_110188 Thu, 26 May 2011 09:10:04 +0100 Mike (Up North)
A study by John Clegg Consulting showed that UK biomass demand could exceed 27million tonnes by 2017, which is more than the current global trade in woodchips and pellets.


The full article on the Balcas / Brites wood hunger is here

Read more: http://energy.pressandjournal.co.uk/Article.aspx/2252910/#ixzz1NRZeXSDH

Hope the link works - just paste it in

Cheers

Mike up North]]>