Sat, 09 May 2026 04:35:00 +0100 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/ Lussumo Vanilla 1.0.3 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=99411#Comment_99411 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=99411#Comment_99411 Mon, 17 Jan 2011 12:19:59 +0000 SteamyTea ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=99484#Comment_99484 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=99484#Comment_99484 Mon, 17 Jan 2011 23:50:48 +0000 rhamdu
(No I'm not saying it's worth doing. I am just saying it could be done.)]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101128#Comment_101128 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101128#Comment_101128 Wed, 02 Feb 2011 13:15:41 +0000 SteamyTea For those of you who were interested I have just order the new DG unit of for my back door. 1m by 0.64m, 20mm gap with 4mm toughened glass, gnats under £40. Could have had K glass and would have been about 15 quid more. Asked about argon filled and the man said, leaks out after 3 or 4 years anyway, not worth it except to get past the BCO.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101135#Comment_101135 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101135#Comment_101135 Wed, 02 Feb 2011 13:59:19 +0000 DamonHD
Rgds

Damon]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101138#Comment_101138 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101138#Comment_101138 Wed, 02 Feb 2011 14:11:01 +0000 djh Posted By: SteamyTeaAsked about argon filled and the man said, leaks out after 3 or 4 years anyway, not worth it except to get past the BCO.
Hmm, does that mean there's a big conspiracy? Or is it an indication to use a different glass merchant?]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101142#Comment_101142 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101142#Comment_101142 Wed, 02 Feb 2011 14:19:35 +0000 tony https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101144#Comment_101144 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101144#Comment_101144 Wed, 02 Feb 2011 14:26:10 +0000 SteamyTea Know idea what the U-Value is, can look it up as it is a standard make up for a window (2.8W/m^2K), could have gone better but it hardly seemed worth going triple glazing. I am not after the ultimate, just something better than a single pane I have in. Going to change the ply panel to a double one with some mineral wool put in it while I do it. An area that is often forgotten.

DJH
It was me that brought the subject up with him and he said it was the rep that told him as they do not make gas filled on site. Asked how one can check if it is gas filled and he said there is a meter but they are not very accurate.
having dealt with many suppliers in many different fields over the last 30 years in manufacturing I can generally tell which ones are good or bad, though can get caught out sometimes.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101162#Comment_101162 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101162#Comment_101162 Wed, 02 Feb 2011 17:32:32 +0000 RobL I'm suprised you stopped at regular DG glass. The argon + low e + warm edge is so much better technically than that. I can see there's an unknown long term issue with argon escaping - but the low e will remain.
The marginal cost increase of the best glass over the cheapest gives the best glass quite a quick payback.
The BFRC window rating equation:
http://www.defra.gov.uk/sustainable/government/advice/public/buying/products/construction/documents/bfrc-guidance-note.pdf
gives the power loss due to the U value (ignore solar gain and air infiltration) as 68.5KWh per year per U. Obviously, this makes UK assumptions about where you live, and how warm your house is. Most people in the UK after an improved glass of U=2.8 to U=1.2, would save 68.5*1.6 KWh of heat energy per year per m^2.
At 5p/KWh heat (after effiency losses), thats £5.48 saving per year per m^2 of better glass.
The U=1.2 glass can be got for £68 per m^2 - that gives a payback of 12.4 years even if you have good old DG that you just throw away.
Where else can you get that sort of payback, without a grant or FIT/RHI ? *

For me, it worked out a lot better than replacing my old boiler (stated effy = 0.78 to stated effy = 0.93) at £3000 I get a payback of 36 years. I will probably do even this eventually, but despite BG insistance, it should actually be low down on my list of priorities (it's even a worse return on investment than external wall insulation on our already cavity filled house)

* Ok, assume loft & obvious cavity walls sorted. :-)]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101166#Comment_101166 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101166#Comment_101166 Wed, 02 Feb 2011 17:53:03 +0000 Joiner
http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/forum114/comments.php?DiscussionID=6511

Short memories you lot! Supposed to happen only to the aged, so act your ages!!]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101173#Comment_101173 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101173#Comment_101173 Wed, 02 Feb 2011 18:47:52 +0000 SteamyTea I got the place up for sale and trend here is to replace the windows as soon as someone new moves in, and as I now have my total load down to 500W, that included water, light, refrigeration, cooking, entertainment, really can't see the point. Boor is a bit crooked so may be changing that in future anyway. Should have done it before the winter but but was busy. I agree that if I was replacing everything again I would go for Low e, but as using old frames I could not easily go triple, which is probably the better way. Still as the door is about a fifth of the wall area it will be interesting to see what 40 quid does.
Loft has loads in it and no condensation issues that I can detect at moment and I can still store stuff up there, got some temp sensor dotted all over the place so shall see what the data shows when I get around to it, have some data from last couple of years. What I can say is that the storage heater (no gas here) is now down to 2 on the input and currently closed on the output, quite warm here at moment. Volume is about 170 m^3.

Joiner
I remember that thread and remember that I did not contribute to it. ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101205#Comment_101205 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101205#Comment_101205 Thu, 03 Feb 2011 09:40:03 +0000 RobL Oh no ...
My wife calls me an eco-bore. And I see the glazed look in people's eyes at work when I talk about flying less. And now here too...

:-)]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101208#Comment_101208 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101208#Comment_101208 Thu, 03 Feb 2011 09:46:35 +0000 Joiner ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101212#Comment_101212 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101212#Comment_101212 Thu, 03 Feb 2011 10:03:38 +0000 SteamyTea Just for a giggle in conversation I see how quick I can get from football (something I dislike) to Energy, usually less than a minute. The flip side is justifying Formula 1 (something I like) as a development platform for future generations of vehicles, usually about 15 seconds.
]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101553#Comment_101553 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101553#Comment_101553 Sun, 06 Feb 2011 11:52:33 +0000 rhamdu http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/double-glazing-advice-wtd-any-window-fitters-on-here

"Argon will leak from polysulphide sealed units, but will stay in silicone sealed units."

Ok, back to F1...]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101869#Comment_101869 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101869#Comment_101869 Tue, 08 Feb 2011 18:13:45 +0000 RobL U=1.2 2G 4:20:4 Planitherm Total+ Argon fill warm edge £60/m^2
U=0.7 3G 4:8:4:8:4 2off Planitherm Total+ Krypton fill warm edge £180/m^2
(figs include VAT but not delivery (£90)).

for 2G U=1.2, my marginal improvement on what we have is about £38 per deltaU per m^2, 11year payback
for 3G U=0.7, my marginal improvement on the 2G U=1.2 above is £360 per deltaU per m^2
100mm EWI, in contrast, would drop our CWI wall from U=0.6 to U=0.16, marginal improvement £230/deltaU.m^2

Notice how I didn't include paybacks on the 3G or EWI ? Gas is too cheap. Insulating should be more cost effective than burning things. If I were in charge, things would be different

Should I go 2G or 3G?
I think I'll go 3G on the regular windows, as they'll last "forever", and it's interesting!. Not so sure about the patio doors - I'm a bit worried about the extra weight. The doors are fine, nothing special though, but do get a lot of slamming in the summer by the kids. If ever we get around to EWIing, that'll last longer than the 2G-converted-3G patio door would, and is more cost effective.

Can I mention the company.... ? Same one I used last time, am impressed with them. No I don't have shares/work for/get kickback for adverts ! Man up RobL, just do it !

http://www.sggs.com/SolaGlas/Contact%20Us/Affiliates_Solaglas/South_East/Introduction.asp]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101871#Comment_101871 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101871#Comment_101871 Tue, 08 Feb 2011 18:21:05 +0000 DamonHD

Rgds

Damon]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101880#Comment_101880 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101880#Comment_101880 Tue, 08 Feb 2011 20:27:01 +0000 jamesingram
Key areas are the bathroom and kitchen.
Use lids when boiling/simmering water/food
Close doors when cooking/showering/bathing to keep the water vapour in the room
brush of as much water as possible down before toweling
Use a window squeegy to get excess water of shower wall/surround once finished( also help with limescale staining)
Use extractors fans whilst cooking/showering
or open a window in these rooms whilst doing the above
Wipe any condensation off windows etc each morning with a cloth and dry outside
Dont dry washing indoor unless you have to.
close the toilet lid ?
do use :
Ventilation
Thermal blinds
Pressure cookers
MHRV/whole house HRV
Built in wardrobes often get condensation in the back of them.
ensure that all internal surface temperatures are above the dewpoint for the relative humidity in the house
Average source, break down -
45% from showers, 35% from drying clothes, 13% from cooking, 7% from breathing/sweating
Improve/upgrade you windows]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101885#Comment_101885 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=101885#Comment_101885 Tue, 08 Feb 2011 21:25:00 +0000 Dominic Cooney This has seemed to make a big difference this year.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=104044#Comment_104044 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=104044#Comment_104044 Fri, 04 Mar 2011 20:58:08 +0000 mands https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=104171#Comment_104171 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=104171#Comment_104171 Sat, 05 Mar 2011 23:04:23 +0000 rhamdu
Now, while our eco-refurb of our new home completes, we are renting an end of terrace house with solid walls, old metal-framed double glazing, and no insulation apart from the roof. Suddenly I am witnessing the things people describe. We have to keep wardrobes open to prevent the clothes getting soggy. There is dew on the window frames. The bathroom paint is peeling. Moisture pours down the toilet walls. Whatever the thermometer says, draughts and a low radiant temperature ensure that I shiver if I don't wear a down vest .

At last I begin to understand why people go on about this subject. They live in houses like this one.]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161749#Comment_161749 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161749#Comment_161749 Mon, 19 Nov 2012 16:21:45 +0000 jamesingram Moisture and Mold Prevention and Control Tips
http://www.epa.gov/mold/preventionandcontrol.html

http://www.epa.gov/mold/moldguide.html

10 things you should know about mold
http://www.epa.gov/mold/moldresources.html]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161753#Comment_161753 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161753#Comment_161753 Mon, 19 Nov 2012 16:56:52 +0000 Mike George http://www.norwich.gov.uk/Housing/HousingInformationAndAdvice/documents/Condensationanddamp.pdf]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161754#Comment_161754 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161754#Comment_161754 Mon, 19 Nov 2012 17:03:49 +0000 jamesingram bit of a catch 22 when you're a fruggle energy saver]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161755#Comment_161755 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161755#Comment_161755 Mon, 19 Nov 2012 17:11:22 +0000 Mike George
I keep my house at 19 deg between 6.30am and 10.30pm. I do get some condensation but given that I have 3 young kids and uninsulated solid walls its not too bad]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161756#Comment_161756 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161756#Comment_161756 Mon, 19 Nov 2012 17:23:57 +0000 Nick Parsons https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161759#Comment_161759 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161759#Comment_161759 Mon, 19 Nov 2012 17:32:33 +0000 Mike George https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161763#Comment_161763 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161763#Comment_161763 Mon, 19 Nov 2012 17:55:40 +0000 jamesingram Posted By: Mike George given that I have 3 young kids and uninsulated solid walls its not too bad
same here. the estates 'no fines' and most have problem
It's more a case of not needing any heating rather than short burst, its not really come on at all so far this year (other than wood stove in lounge)
though I think I may need to leave it on at a low return temp if it get bad again (just got my PV FIT payment so I'll upgrade my G rate boiler to a little condensing one, which should improve thing also).

Nick, I agree "keep that bloody bathroom door shut !" differcult with younger children though
I've just fitted small mhrv to try to redirect the flow of air from the cold to the warm side of the house ,
as the extract only in the (warm side) bathroom didnt have much effect.
more detail here.
http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/forum114/comments.php?DiscussionID=9740&page=1#Item_26]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161772#Comment_161772 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161772#Comment_161772 Mon, 19 Nov 2012 19:18:59 +0000 Nick Parsons
Rising butts? Fire-door closer?]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161773#Comment_161773 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161773#Comment_161773 Mon, 19 Nov 2012 19:22:38 +0000 SteamyTea Posted By: Nick ParsonsRising buttsHow I usually get off the can ]]> https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161778#Comment_161778 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=6773&Focus=161778#Comment_161778 Mon, 19 Nov 2012 21:27:51 +0000 atomicbisf
A modest amount of condensation is to be expected in bathrooms and kitchens, but I don't think it should have to so severely restrict your behaviour. Something is wrong if you have to worry about keeping a lid on a saucepan I think.]]>