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  1.  
    ST, what you say would normally be correct to a certain extent except that the "free market" does not exist as you describe.
    The markets are heavily manipulated and distorted with subsidies, derivitives and a multitude of other exotic complicated devices. All of which serve to dsitort the markest heavily in favour of western economies, multinationals and most importantly bankS.
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeJul 25th 2011 edited
     
    Staff of Lehmans' Bank may disagree with you there, as may the Greek ruling elite.
    But yes they do tend to have government intervention somewhere along the chain, usually though barriers and restraints to trade and taxes. All this does though is increases the time span between the transaction taking place and the goods being delivered. Not really a problem with trinkets but can be an issue with food and raw materials, those these tend to be the ones that are least affected. I think if you look at the countries that are most affected by natural disasters, the ones that suffer the worse have the greatest restrictions on then. So if a country decided that it will not allow intellectual exchange or imposes high taxes on imported goods and services, in effect an isolation policy, then those people will suffer.
    Called cutting of your nose to spite your face.
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeJul 25th 2011
     
    "I think if you look at the countries that are most affected by natural disasters, the ones that suffer the worse have the greatest restrictions on then. So if a country decided that it will not allow intellectual exchange or imposes high taxes on imported goods and services, in effect an isolation policy, then those people will suffer."

    ST, Cornwall is another county in the UK, not another planet!

    China is about as restrictive as you can get, yet bankrolls the rest of the world.

    And, embarrassingly for capitalism...

    http://www.thedesimag.com/2011/07/19/obama%E2%80%99s-economy-%E2%80%93-america%E2%80%99s-debt-crisis/

    http://money.cnn.com/2011/07/24/news/economy/debt_ceiling_no_deal/index.htm

    http://corker.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?p=america-s-debt-crisis

    ... Tell me when to stop! :wink:
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeJul 25th 2011
     
    Posted By: JoinerChina is about as restrictive as you can get, yet bankrolls the rest of the world.

    Not when it comes to global trade and the implementation of the capital system.

    Trust me Cornwall is in another time zone, but -20 years.

    Shall read those articles later, just about to 'go up-country' away from the Emmets, should be crossing the Tamar in an hour or so. Found passport and have double the normal cash in my wallet. :wink:
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeJul 25th 2011
     
    OK. If you pick this up when you get back, pick the bones out of this...

    http://www.city-journal.org/2011/21_3_otbie-uk-govt-spending.html

    :bigsmile::bigsmile:
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeJul 25th 2011 edited
     
    Posted By: Joinerat a time when the whole world is falling apart because the reality of peak oil has hit home at last.

    What are they going to do? Walk to the trouble-spot? Wait for the troublemakers to come to the grounded helicopter gunships?

    Always biofuel, of course, if there's enough left over from feedstock for biomass electricity generation
    What'll happen is that 'essential' national needs, meaning armed forces and security services first of all, will get first cut at whatever fuel there is (far from 'if there's enough left over from feedstock'), which will greatly exaggerate the supply and shortage that the rest of us will experience, in descending order of priority. For a long interim period, starting quite soon, it won't be absolute shortage, or even price, that will force everyone (at last) to find ways to do without fuel - but unreliability of supply.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeJul 25th 2011
     
    Posted By: SteamyTeaan energy decent plan (as the Transition people like to call it)
    If only there was a decent plan, with which to negotiate the coming descent (as the Transition people like to call it)
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2011
     
    Posted By: fostertombut unreliability of supply.

    That I agree with totally, but could lead to hoarding.

    Posted By: fostertomIf only there was a decent plan

    An Economist would say there is, called sector price escalation.
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2011
     
    Ah, if only there were more economists around. We wouldn't be in this economic mess then.

    As for there being such a thing as "a decent plan"? There probably is, somewhere. All the rest of us need do is hang around until the economists stop arguing about which one of them has it.
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2011
     
    And just had this from an American correspondent...

    "We are starting to see the effects of massive government spending in the form of inflation. I expect it to get much worse.

    During the Carter administration they formed the energy department with the stated goal to reduce our dependence on foreign oil. That department now has 160,000 employees and our dependence has increased. By bureaucrat standards I'm sure that would be a success."

    We're in agreement that actually, as far as the UN proposal goes, nothing will be done because the real world is governed by politicians and the administration(s) they control.
  2.  
    The departmental of energy has 16000 employees, not 160000!
    • CommentAuthorowlman
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2011
     
    Posted By: Joiner: Ah, if only there were more economists around. We wouldn't be in this economic mess then.

    Q. Whats the difference between a tragedy and a catastrophe?

    A. A tragedy is a boatload of economists going down in a storm, A catastrophe is discovering they can all swim. :bigsmile:
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2011
     
    :bigsmile:
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2011
     
    I'll tell him, Bot. Where on earth did you find that figure so that I can point him in the right direction?
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