Green Building Forum - How to value and sell a half built project

How to value and sell a half built project

pmusgrove — Sun, 15 Jan 2012 19:59:40 +0000

Well, Wellington seems to be in the heart of the West Country although the Jnnaers in Plymouth believe the west starts at the Tamar bridge! The point is well made though; the great thing about this forum is that we are not wasting time and energy travelling. But if someone needed a lot of assistance and it was worth a day of looking over "stuff" with them it may be worth a journey. My limit is Bristol to the North and Plymouth to the west; south Wilts just about makes it as well.

How to value and sell a half built project

wookey — Sun, 15 Jan 2012 21:15:29 +0000

We (some of the members who live not too far from Cambridge) have already been having informal 'Cambridge Area Green building spods' events in the pub from time to time, where we provide mutual design advice and an understanding audience who are actually interested :-) It might be time to widen those out a bit.

Perhaps a running 'GBF meetups' thread for anyone to post regional events in?

How to value and sell a half built project

JSHarris — Sun, 15 Jan 2012 22:07:25 +0000

Posted By: wookeyWe (some of the members who live not too far from Cambridge) have already been having informal 'Cambridge Area Green building spods' events in the pub from time to time, where we provide mutual design advice and an understanding audience who are actually interested :-) It might be time to widen those out a bit.

Perhaps a running 'GBF meetups' thread for anyone to post regional events in?

Sounds like a good idea to me. It's a bit lonely trying to work through all the various issues on your own, not to mention the frustration of dealing with planners etc. I'd welcome an opportunity to chat with others locally over a beer or two and exchange ideas. The mutual support,and even mutual spleen-venting at the frustrations of self-build, would be a great stress reliever too!

I'm near Salisbury, Wiltshire and would gladly loosely organise a meet somewhere in this area.

How to value and sell a half built project

Ben1974 — Tue, 17 Jan 2012 18:09:27 +0000

Well first estate agent visited today and the news was a little more promising than I expected. His estimate for the building in it's half finished state would mean that we could exit without an appreciable loss. The finished value for the house was actually a lot higher than I had expected though and he thinks that it would be an easy sell if completed to good standard. The part finished value is about 60% of the finished value which seems to stack up with the estimate JSHarris gave.
He also seemed to think a decent building firm with good project management skills would be able to finish the job in around 12 weeks!

Time to start talking to some building firms I think and see if sums add up. I think the plans will probably have to be scaled back a little so the solar panels may just remain as part of the roof covering with potential for connection at a later date. I think it also means scrubbing round the wood stove with back boiler. The mechanical heat recovery and ventilation will probably have to stay since none of the windows have trickle vents. I've also already purchased the unit and the ducting. It's going to be a complete pain in the backside to install but not impossible.

Obviously I need to bear in mind that I've been talking to an estate agent who will be keen to present things in a promising light to us. However we did manage to keep quiet when he started fishing for how much money it owed us and how much we thought it was worth.

How to value and sell a half built project

tony — Tue, 17 Jan 2012 20:13:23 +0000

get another couple round to get other opinions, well done for making progress.

How to value and sell a half built project

Terry — Tue, 17 Jan 2012 20:52:57 +0000

Yup - get a few more opinions. When my partner sold her place, we got a significant spread of valuations.
If you go the route of getting builders in to finish it, make sure they are aware of the 'difference' between your place and a bog standard house, else your efforts so far might be wasted.

Been in and out a bit over the last few days so might have missed where about's in the country you are Ben, as I might be up for lending a hand from time to time if you are local - if you decide to continue.

We are in the Forest of Dean - Gloucestershire if there are any members keen to meet up.

How to value and sell a half built project

CWatters — Wed, 18 Jan 2012 22:17:36 +0000

One option might be to hire a project manager to complete it using subcontractors. Problem might be finding one. Perhaps speak to your architect?

How to value and sell a half built project

Ben1974 — Thu, 19 Jan 2012 12:10:57 +0000

Cheers, another agent round today who gave a similar value to the last one for it half built but a lower value for the finished product. In fact the difference between fitted out and unfinished was only 50k which I found a little surprising on a 175m2 house.

It's a bit weird going in the building having spent nearly every day in or around it last year. I feel very emotionally detached from it as if it isn't mine any more.

Had some friends round this morning who advised me to wait until the spring before making a decision. It certainly won't be going anywhere in a hurry so no problem in that respect.

(We're up in New Mills by the way!)

How to value and sell a half built project

Pingy — Thu, 19 Jan 2012 13:29:50 +0000

Hi Ben,

Good idea to wait until spring. Get some quotes from local builders in the mean time to see how much it'd cost you to get it livable without you having do it single handedly, that's what I'm going to do. Remember you don't need mega-expensive bathroom suites and kitchen, go for economy as these could always be upgraded later.

Another thing worth remembering is the cost of fuel. Presumably your new house will be significantly cheaper to run. I can see fuel poverty is going to become commonplace, so long term it may be worth sticking with it and try and work out a way of financing the remainder of the build. The reason I'm doing mine is because of the uncertain future and I don't want to be one of the unfortunate ones that has to work just to pay the fuel bills.

How to value and sell a half built project

gustyturbine — Thu, 19 Jan 2012 13:39:52 +0000

Pingy,
That was the main reason I went for a GSHP. No mains gas in my area and I wanted to ditch oil at all costs. I also burn a few logs now and again. So far so good,
Gusty.

How to value and sell a half built project

Triassic — Thu, 19 Jan 2012 13:55:18 +0000

I read your story like this - At present youâ€™ve financed the build from savings and it will only take Â£50k to finish. The final product will be worth more than you thought?

So if you got a mortgage for Â£50k against the part built house you could get the builders in and get it finished in 12 weeks? Would you need to get a job to pay the mortgage or do you have 12 weeks to spare to be the Project Manager?

I ask these questions because I want you to succeed. There is nothing better than sitting in a house you built. When I say 'you built' I mean â€˜youâ€™ - using your blood, sweat and by the sounds of it a few tears!! Iâ€™m sat in my â€˜self buildâ€™ at the moment and am planning the next one, when I say â€˜self buildâ€™ I mean extreme renovation project (the structural engineer called to say he thinks the rear wall and roof on the next project may collapse due to ongoing settlement before we complete the purchase !!)

With all this Green Building Forum love behind you, you can do it and have a house to be proud of.

If it helps, according to Google maps, I'm only 36.3 miles away and am more than willing to give you a day of my time to help you thrash out ideas and plans. You only have to ask !!!!!

How to value and sell a half built project

Ben1974 — Thu, 19 Jan 2012 18:32:02 +0000

Thanks all and Triassic I might well take you up on the offer but not right at the moment.

I might start sounding out a few building firms in the meanwhile and see if I can get some idea of costs from them. An estate agent is probably not the best source to rely on as a QS!

Let wait for the sun to start shining again. Outside and inside!

How to value and sell a half built project

Ben1974 — Wed, 25 Jan 2012 11:00:47 +0000

More progress.

I've had a building firm come and measure up with a view to giving me a price to complete to a basic standard. They came recommended by an architect friend and all seems good. We're only talking ball park figures at the moment but it'll be a good starting point.

It's causing a little bit of marital friction as my wife is pretty upset to be letting go of the dream but we're talking it through. The only thing you can do in these situations is talk and listen.

Struggling to sleep properly at the moment and just about surviving on 3 hours a night! It feels better to be moving positively towards sorting it out.

How to value and sell a half built project

seascape — Wed, 25 Jan 2012 16:37:37 +0000

Glad to hear there has been some progress and hope you get it sorted out, sounds like you need a break for a while - things may look different as you get a solution. I've also had many a sleepless night and major domestics over my build, so you are not alone in this. Now I take my time and do things slowly - sleep will return!

How to value and sell a half built project

CWatters — Thu, 26 Jan 2012 13:53:02 +0000

Very long shot but how about applying to DIY SOS?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/showsandtours/shows/beonashow/diy_sos

How to value and sell a half built project

Ben1974 — Fri, 27 Jan 2012 18:52:59 +0000

One of my wife's friends is desperate to do that as she really fancies Nick Knowles. I think there are more worth cases out there though.

My parents told me about a recent show where some poor chap in the middle of Wales was building when his wife died of cancer leaving him with two children in a caravan. He was then diagnosed with cancer himself. A genuine case of hardship.

As an update a builder who came to look at has suggested he can get it habitable for about Â£35k! Will be a basic spec with conventional radiators etc etc and it's going to be up to me to project manage and sort out services etc. It's going to need some detail nailing down on it as it's all a bit loose at the moment. I asked him not to break his back preparing a detailed quote. I just wanted him to look at and give me an idea. He has suggested that the main bulk of the expense will be the plaster-boarding and plastering. It's a reputable firm and they are keen to have their board outside the house as it's attracted quite a lot of attention in the area.

Looks like there could be a TISUN thermal store, solar station and a woodfire 12i stove with gubbins up for sale sometime soon though.

I'm not feeling totally confident about managing it considering my performance to date and I still need to go through the financial details with my wife. Unfortunately she is a self employed accountant and January means she is up to her eyeballs in work at the moment. She also needs to come to terms with the fact that it is going to be a compromise on the original idea.

Had my first good nights sleep last night 5 hours. Went to bed in a positive frame of mind and woke up in a positive frame of mind. I think it was mainly down to a vigorous morning helping the in-laws dig over their veg patch in the company of my 4 year old son and with some rare January Peak District sunshine!

How to value and sell a half built project

JSHarris — Fri, 27 Jan 2012 19:23:23 +0000

That sounds like really great news, Ben. I really hope things work out for you, even if it means making compromises for now.

How to value and sell a half built project

Ben1974 — Thu, 02 Feb 2012 18:28:07 +0000

Hi All,

Just seen the messages including the whispered ones. So thanks all.

We have spoken to a few builders now and although the prices look promising it still requires some work to nail it down. To this end we have decided that it would prudent to engage an architect friend to oversea the final stages (whatever combination of builder,me, hired help or favours). One of the basic problems I have had is that the building reg approval was only conditional. Basically I just worked on a building notice and agreed things as I went along. Dangerous in extreme especially if you haven't a lot of experience! After analysing things I feel that it wasn't the physical work that did for me it was the pressure of having to make decisions on the fly.

They say learn from your mistakes and don't expect to carry on the same way and not have things still go wrong the same way!

The idea is that with a proper set of plans and a spec for the final stages to make sure the building definitely complies with the regs will provide a "road map" to completion. This will remove me from the decision making part of the process and hopefully kick-start things.

The first thing I need to deal with is getting the water, electricity and gas onto site. We obtained quotes for these at the beginning of the build but since we live next door and have power and water available there was no pressing need to expend money getting them in. There is however a slight problem with the situation as the building is against a retaining wall and services will have to bridge the gap. I will post the pics and query in the new build section as they may be of interest to others. I have the DNO engineers coming out next week.

As for the offers of help and the idea that it could be a good way to get together and meet new people. I love the idea but I need to know what is happening first. My wife and I are really trying to make a positive story out of this experience and that sounds one way of doing it. We have had lots of offers of help from our friends in the area to but it's just so difficult to know where to start. Things are coming together though!

Thanks again all.

How to value and sell a half built project

SteamyTea — Thu, 02 Feb 2012 18:58:47 +0000

Ben
Sounds like it is heading in the right direction, what we like to hear.

How to value and sell a half built project

willie.macleod — Sat, 04 Feb 2012 19:46:21 +0000

Posted By: Ben1974He has suggested that the main bulk of the expense will be the plaster-boarding and plastering.

If you are looking to get in fast, you might want to consider not plastering - I am planning to use Fermacell with joint stick between the sheets which should be quick to put in and can be painted straight over. It is a bit more expensive per sheet compared to plasterboard, but much better in other ways. Would save a lot of time compared to boarding, then waiting for the plasterer, them taking ages and giving the new plaster time to dry, filling the cracks etc. Much better for hanging stuff on as well.

How to value and sell a half built project

joe90 — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 11:54:02 +0000

Posted By: willie.macleod
Posted By: Ben1974He has suggested that the main bulk of the expense will be the plaster-boarding and plastering.
>blockquote>

Have you considered taper edge board and "muding" the joint like lots of americans do. I had to quote for building a showroom (plasterboard walls) in a factory and it came out a lot cheaper doing it this way and the finish was very good.

How to value and sell a half built project

joe90 — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 11:56:25 +0000

That did not come out quite right???? but you know what I mean.

How to value and sell a half built project

Ben1974 — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 14:56:18 +0000

I did look at fermacell initially as the fact that there would be less wet trades involved appealed. However I think in reality it would be quite hard to achieve the precise fit between the boards for a good finished appearance.

I'll bear the suggestion in mind though. Once the architect has worked up a spec and we start getting quotes there is probably going to be a certain amount of juggling involved to get the price right.

How to value and sell a half built project

marktime — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 15:07:56 +0000

Ben, there is absolutely no need to skim plaster plasterboard. You want someone who knows what he is doing and you'll get a result that will bear examination in all but the severest lighting conditions. Gets you away quicker as there is no drying out to wait for.

Fermacell is great,not fussy about joins as you sand them away. Downside is the're Bl**dy heavy!

Great to see a positive tone appearing in your posts.

How to value and sell a half built project

SteamyTea — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 15:17:26 +0000

Posted By: marktimeGreat to see a positive tone appearing in your posts

Ben, might be time to change the thread title

How to value and sell a half built project

andy500 — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 19:31:37 +0000

Just read all of this - I agree the donkey work isn't the problem, it's the mental stuff.
It does look like there's light at the end of the tunnel though, so stick with it.
I'm 6 years in so far on this house, currently in glass-half-full mode, but have been through a fair few lows as well, partly because it seems never-ending, and partly down to the way we've lived to get where we are now I suppose. Kids just think it's normal, having a few floorless rooms here and there, and a daddy covered in dust most of the time.
I'm only a couple of miles from New Mills - Marple Bridge - have done my own MVHR system amongst other stuff so if I can be of any help, advice, even hands-on help, feel free to contact me. How the hell you make contact on this forum I have no idea though?

How to value and sell a half built project

joe90 — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 23:01:28 +0000

andy500,

you need to whisper your email or tel number.

How to value and sell a half built project

Ben1974 — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 11:12:20 +0000

Hi all,

We have now appointed an architect friend to draw up plans for finishing the building. This is to ensure we don't miss any building regs issues and to allow us to put out to tender the remaining work and see if that option for finishing is one that we can work with.

We have embraced the suggestions made about scaling back the plans for finishing and so will be specifying a conventional we central heating system. This means that we will have to make up the finished floor levels on the ground and first floor.

The ground floor is isn't a problem as it just a case of screeding to finished level. However to the 1st floor we have a block and beam floor than needs 120mm on it to bring up to FF (including the floor finish). There have been a number of options suggested but I wanted to get some opinions from here.

Opt 1: Chipboard flooring over Jablite
Opt 2: Batten out Block and Beam floor with 4" (or as reqd) joists and lay chipboard flooring over.
Opt 3: Screed to finished level.

The advantage to my mind of the jablite is it might help with sound and thermal (insulation) over the garage. The disadvantage is possibly that is might collapse if heavy weights are placed on top.

Battening out the floor will give a service space underneath (however there is already space to the underside of the block and beam floor where counter battened) but I think it might make it quite noisy and possibly not help with some of the airtightness issues we have with block and beam floor.

Any opinions?

Cheers

Ben

How to value and sell a half built project

CWatters — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 15:12:30 +0000

Are the stairs in? If not then perhaps you could change the ffl on the first floor and adjust the strair pitch to suit the new ffl-ffl distance.

Is Jablite dense enough for floors? In the distant past I heard of people having problems with EPS breaking up when used under chipboard. What happened was that repeated foot fall at doorways caused slight deflection of the chipboard that compressed the EPS allowing more deflection etc. Eventually the EPS was like a bath sponge.

How to value and sell a half built project

RobinB — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 17:29:25 +0000

I would go with an insulation foam - maybe not jablite but I'm sure there's something out there suitable. Maybe some kind of Kingspan seconds boards - I used them on our sitting room floor, floated chipboard over and then finished with an engineered timber floor. Seems OK.