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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

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    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeJul 5th 2012 edited
     
    Wow, that's the chapter and verse for outboarding windows then - v gd.

    While you're at it, I'd be ever so interested to see the frame pushed
    a) entirely just outboard of the masonry i.e. corner to corner with the masonry, with that majonry jamb insulation removed (that's how I've been doing it). and
    b) as that corner-to-corner is prob a weak point, frame pushed yet further outboard, so say 30mm away from masonry outside face.

    These wd of course require thicker EWI - but EWI reveal depth, back to window outside face, need be no more than say 1.3 x the EWI's overlap distance across outside face of frame. So if overlap is say 25, then increasing EWI reveal depth greater than 35 won't improve the numbers. Tho, with these open-in windows, overlap cd easily be 50 or even 70, so reveal depth greater than 35 wd then be worthwhile.
    • CommentAuthorShevek
    • CommentTimeJul 5th 2012
     
    Thanks again Timber, it'll probably be even better because we'll probably be using PIR.
    • CommentAuthorShevek
    • CommentTimeFeb 2nd 2013 edited
     
    So here's my updated detail. We're going with Ecocontract triple-glazed timber windows, 0.9 u-value (added benefit with these windows is that we can also overlap the insulation at the sill).
    1. Is it realistic to bend the straps 90 degrees like that? I want to do that in order to fit the XPS insulation snugly.
    2. What screws should I spec to fix into window and into the masonry?

    Any ideas on how we might protect the windows once they're installed if we don't install the insulation for a while?
    • CommentAuthorchippyclaus
    • CommentTimeFeb 2nd 2013 edited
     
    Its looking much improved to the initial drawing. Why dont you fix battens on bracket height into the reveal and save yourself bending the bracket. We had the same type of windows and fitted them just under 3 years ago looking very good still. I wouldn't worry about the weather getting to them, if you seal between frame and brickwork, maybe fit a triangular piece on the head to let water run off easier.
    By the way I ran 50mm of insulation up against the frames, which are about 80mm thick.
    • CommentAuthoreniacs
    • CommentTimeFeb 2nd 2013
     
    Shevek; Ive just installed a window, very similar in design to yours with insulation surrounding the reveal and the window mounted itself into the insulation. I am intending on doing EWI, but probably not for at least a year yet. The only difference is that my window is flush with the wall and so i was able to use normal screws directly into the blockwork. At present the outer part looks a mess as the insulation surrounding the frame is visible and the sill is huge! But it is watertight (ish) until the new EWI is completed next year.
    • CommentAuthoreniacs
    • CommentTimeFeb 3rd 2013
     
    Its also worth thinking about replacement of frames, the frames i took out of my house were probably from 1995 ish, so maybe 18 years old. But they needed replacing, rubber seals tired and no longer effective, glazing units all failed and metal parts corroded. By plastering around the frame on the interior and also rendering and insulating over the frame on the exterior we are making changing the frame a very difficult job!
    • CommentAuthorShevek
    • CommentTimeJun 1st 2014 edited
     
    The ever evolving window detail (update attached).

    I can't decide two things:

    1. Should I use tape instead of sealant where the EWI render meets the window (can we simply stick it to the EPS and render over?)
    2. Should I use two tapes on the inside, one to seal the window to the internal insulation (Tescon Profil) and then another around to seal against the masonry (ME404 butyl fleece tape). Or should I just use one tape, such as Pro Clima Contega PV or FC to seal against the insulation and then plaster over?
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeJun 3rd 2014
     
    We're just going through this cycle; I know the agony of indecision!

    Posted By: ShevekThe ever evolving window detail (update attached).

    I can't decide two things:

    1. Should I use tape instead of sealant where the EWI render meets the window (can we simply stick it to the EPS and render over?)

    Siga do an external window tape; Pro Clima don't as far as I know. If you did use a tape, how will you conceal the part that is stuck to the window?

    Will you want some kind of compressed foam seal as well as the external plaster sealant?

    2. Should I use two tapes on the inside, one to seal the window to the internal insulation (Tescon Profil) and then another around to seal against the masonry (ME404 butyl fleece tape). Or should I just use one tape, such as Pro Clima Contega PV or FC to seal against the insulation and then plaster over?

    I don't think there's any point in sealing to EPS insulation internally. It's not vapour tight or even very airtight ist it? What is the internal airtightness barrier? The plaster? I think you need to seal directly from the window into the plaster (PV) or from the window onto something like DA-S (Profil) and then from the DA-S into the plaster (PV). I've found Ecological Building Systems very helpful.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeJun 3rd 2014
     
    Blimey, all these expensive products - how do I manage to do without? Cd it be Design?
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeJun 3rd 2014
     
    Posted By: fostertomBlimey, all these expensive products - how do I manage to do without? Cd it be Design?

    Go on then, Tom. What would you do?
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeJun 4th 2014
     
    When I woke up this morning I guessed I'd get called on that! - get back to you once I've understood what details you guys are doing.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeJun 4th 2014
     
    Where is your airtightness layer?
    • CommentAuthorShevek
    • CommentTimeJun 4th 2014 edited
     
    Yeah the airtightness layer is the internal plaster.

    It's a terraced house. We're patching existing lime plaster as needed internally but on the external walls (front and rear) we've stripped all internal plaster and we're replacing it with clay plaster.
  1.  
    what's wrong with the ply/osb box idea
    parge behind and ( + thin layer eps again if you want )plasterboard over then skim internal .
    Fire board/eps ewi externally with eps lapping over frame as shevek shows.
    tape internally/externally to ply box if you want or use pu glue/ms poly adhesive for airtight seal
    externally ewi render stop beads to window
    ??
    • CommentAuthorShevek
    • CommentTimeJun 4th 2014
     
    Window are already fitted.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeJun 4th 2014
     
    Nice windows!!

    I sealed insulation to window before reveal lining and stuck a good taped edge of a plasterboard to the frame before plastering, mostly I used acrylic sealants.

    golden rule, seal everything that you can see then seal it all again, I didnt use any tapes and wet plastered the whole house except for the back and pipes side of the airing cupboard
    • CommentAuthorShevek
    • CommentTimeJun 5th 2014 edited
     
    The insulation is sealed against window with PU foam, although I can't remember how thoroughly.

    I was thinking just Tescon Profil tape between window and EPS, and then clay plaster over the whole lot: tape, EPS and brick. Given that the plaster is my airtightness layer.

    Can I simply clay plaster over tape, EPS and brick?
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeJun 5th 2014
     
    I would use fibre scrim over the tapes if you feel that they will do you any good or the clay plaster might delaminates from them and fall off, it should stick to brick OK so long as it is not too shiny or dusty.
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