Green Building Forum - Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? Mon, 15 Jun 2026 07:29:24 +0100 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/ Lussumo Vanilla 1.0.3 Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225480#Comment_225480 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225480#Comment_225480 Sun, 07 Jun 2015 12:01:59 +0100 Mikeee5
Unbelievable people we are dealing with here. They have even mentioned in their statements that I quoted the Clean Air Act when they self installed the none Defra exempt boiler. I would have thought that would be a blatant breach of the CAA in a smoke control area, especially when they were burning painted wood, which they have admitted to in their statements!!!

Mikeee5]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225484#Comment_225484 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225484#Comment_225484 Sun, 07 Jun 2015 13:49:24 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225503#Comment_225503 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225503#Comment_225503 Sun, 07 Jun 2015 21:49:24 +0100 Mikeee5 Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225524#Comment_225524 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225524#Comment_225524 Mon, 08 Jun 2015 11:55:03 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225527#Comment_225527 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225527#Comment_225527 Mon, 08 Jun 2015 17:19:10 +0100 Mikeee5
I've been watching Judge Rinder on TV. There's been one or two neighbour disputes on there which have been quite interesting. I've picked up some useful jargon like "lawful evidence". I've spent most of the weekend arranging an overview and facts of the situation ready for the big day. I have certainly acrued a wealth of lawful bumff now, it's quite amazing how its all come together, I just hope the judge likes reading!!

Mikeee5]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225615#Comment_225615 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225615#Comment_225615 Wed, 10 Jun 2015 12:13:55 +0100 tony Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225768#Comment_225768 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225768#Comment_225768 Sun, 14 Jun 2015 11:56:41 +0100 Mikeee5
Cheers

Mikeee5]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225772#Comment_225772 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225772#Comment_225772 Sun, 14 Jun 2015 15:53:56 +0100 PeterStarck
If not try http://woodburnersmoke.net/Dorothy-Woodsmoke_Cancer_May2011.pdf]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225803#Comment_225803 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=225803#Comment_225803 Mon, 15 Jun 2015 11:30:11 +0100 Mikeee5
All the information I have read in the past has said there is no known safe level of particulate matter exposure from wood smoke!]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226128#Comment_226128 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226128#Comment_226128 Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:52:50 +0100 jamestoldme
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/fine-particulate-matter-pm2-5-in-the-uk]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226296#Comment_226296 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226296#Comment_226296 Sun, 28 Jun 2015 16:38:35 +0100 Mikeee5
I'm just finalising my response to the defendants statements and there are that many lies in them it's unreal. It looks like they are trying to assassinate mine and my wife's characters and trying to make out we are the bad guys in all this. As mentioned previously, I've never been to court before and I'm not sure how it will be seen by the judge if I were to point out the "untruths" .

Have learned this week that the expert witness is not allowed to attend court too which is a bit of a blow!

Mikeee5]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226298#Comment_226298 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226298#Comment_226298 Sun, 28 Jun 2015 17:04:22 +0100 Triassic Posted By: Mikeee5Have learned this week that the expert witness is not allowed to attend court too which is a bit of a blow!
So how is justice served by not allowing him to attend?

What was the reason given that would disqualify his attendance?]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226301#Comment_226301 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226301#Comment_226301 Sun, 28 Jun 2015 17:30:54 +0100 djh Posted By: Mikeee5I'm just finalising my response to the defendants statements and there are that many lies in them it's unreal. It looks like they are trying to assassinate mine and my wife's characters and trying to make out we are the bad guys in all this. As mentioned previously, I've never been to court before and I'm not sure how it will be seen by the judge if I were to point out the "untruths" .
What I'd like to say is: "Don't call people liars - don't refer to their statements at all. But do make a clear statement of the truth of whatever facts it is that are stated wrongly." But without seeing all the documents, I can't be absolutely sure that's the right advice.

+1 on Triassic's question]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226303#Comment_226303 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226303#Comment_226303 Sun, 28 Jun 2015 18:13:57 +0100 Mikeee5
Djh, that's pretty much what I've done. I've responded to their statements with the true facts and have emailed them to my solicitor. They are playing very heavily on "the council say we're doing nothing wrong and no nuisance exists". Tinki Winki has witnessed the fumes on my property, they know damn well there is a problem!]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226304#Comment_226304 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226304#Comment_226304 Sun, 28 Jun 2015 18:33:40 +0100 bot de paille
Stick to the facts and present your arguments in a lucid and level headed manner without resorting to emotion and hopefully this will enable the magistrate to use his/her professionalism to examine the facts clearly.

I think your main chance of winning is if they see that your complaints are valid and reasonably presented, and not just a frivolous "neighbors who dont get on" tiff]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226326#Comment_226326 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226326#Comment_226326 Mon, 29 Jun 2015 09:55:22 +0100 Mikeee5
I'd like to do a presentation and tell it like it is if possible.There's not a single thing been falsified. The videos of the smoke returning to ground don't lie and the witnesses that are coming with me have all witnessed the severity of the fumes first hand.

Mikeee5]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226330#Comment_226330 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226330#Comment_226330 Mon, 29 Jun 2015 12:02:09 +0100 CWatters Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226337#Comment_226337 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226337#Comment_226337 Mon, 29 Jun 2015 14:48:14 +0100 djh Posted By: CWattersSeems daft that unqualified witnesses are allowed but expert ones aren't.
Yes, there must be more to the story; hence Triassic's question.]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226338#Comment_226338 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226338#Comment_226338 Mon, 29 Jun 2015 15:22:51 +0100 owlman Presumably if one particular "expert" written statement appears to carry weight or is inconsistent and requires clarification then the court will decide if that expert is called for cross examination by either the judge and/or both parties.

I'm no expert only guessing]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226340#Comment_226340 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226340#Comment_226340 Mon, 29 Jun 2015 16:33:38 +0100 Mikeee5 Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226352#Comment_226352 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226352#Comment_226352 Mon, 29 Jun 2015 21:11:24 +0100 bot de paille
The court can refuse EWs for a number of reasons, if they feel it is not necessary.

The argument has been made that the refusal to allow an EW might prejudice the chances of a persons ability to present their case in a fair manner. There is even an article of the European Humans Rights act that has precedence over UK law, to the effect that a persons right to EWs in court is a human right to be enforced by law.

So far any appeals made in referencing the European Human Rights act have failed, ie UK courts are just ignoring it for the moment. You could make an appeal Mikeee5 but its probably not going to succeed and might even turn the court against you.]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226353#Comment_226353 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226353#Comment_226353 Mon, 29 Jun 2015 21:17:56 +0100 bot de paille Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226367#Comment_226367 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226367#Comment_226367 Tue, 30 Jun 2015 10:50:21 +0100 Mikeee5
Thanks for you reasurance too bot, let's hope the court sees these people for what they really are!]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226505#Comment_226505 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226505#Comment_226505 Thu, 02 Jul 2015 14:08:15 +0100 db8000 Posted By: Mikeee5I've done a few searches on the expert witnesses not being allowed in court and as you say there are a number of reasons that they may not be allowed to attend. The smelly tubbies have requested that they produce a report from an expert witness regarding the carbon monoxide readings that were included in the report. It will be interesting to see if the court allows that! We've had the disclosure now and I think it will conflict with the evidence already disclosed, I don't think it should be allowed!

Thanks for you reasurance too bot, let's hope the court sees these people for what they really are!

It doesn't sound like the expert witnesses has been refused but that only he/she can give evidence in writing. If that is the case then sometimes there is an opportunity to put further questions to the expert for answering before the hearing - that might depend on the directions from the court.

That the expert witness is not attending is not altogether surprising if the expert is a joint expert. There is the issue of proportionality fro the court's point of view and if the expert is joint, there cannot be any cross-examination.

If the expert is not joint (i.e. instructed by one side or the other only) then it is more surprising that they are not allowed to attend but again the judge may have decided that the case is more proportionality dealt with this way. An expert in attendance and cross-examined will add half a day to a trial.

The expert's report should be addressed to the court and must state that they understand their duties to the court.

Dave]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226506#Comment_226506 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226506#Comment_226506 Thu, 02 Jul 2015 14:11:45 +0100 db8000 Posted By: Mikeee5I've been to see her family and they are not very happy that there mother has been dooped into providing a statement!!! They are going to help her withdraw the statement formally.

Unbelievable people we are dealing with here. They have even mentioned in their statements that I quoted the Clean Air Act when they self installed the none Defra exempt boiler. I would have thought that would be a blatant breach of the CAA in a smoke control area, especially when they were burning painted wood, which they have admitted to in their statements!!!

Mikeee5

You have to tell your solicitor. Her witness statement will stand otherwise. The judge will know no better.

It doesn't sound like it's appropriate to summons her to court to cross-examine her (you can in fact summons opponent's witnesses) but you must do something, not just rely on the family to write something.]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226507#Comment_226507 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226507#Comment_226507 Thu, 02 Jul 2015 14:19:14 +0100 db8000 Posted By: djh
Posted By: Mikeee5I'm just finalising my response to the defendants statements and there are that many lies in them it's unreal. It looks like they are trying to assassinate mine and my wife's characters and trying to make out we are the bad guys in all this. As mentioned previously, I've never been to court before and I'm not sure how it will be seen by the judge if I were to point out the "untruths" .


What I'd like to say is: "Don't call people liars - don't refer to their statements at all. But do make a clear statement of the truth of whatever facts it is that are stated wrongly." But without seeing all the documents, I can't be absolutely sure that's the right advice..

Indeed. You can quite happily point out that you disagree with their version of the events. The judge will make a finding as to who he/she believes.

Besides, if witness statements are in, there is not usually any further opportunity to address this before trial.

Do you have a barrister for the trial? A half decent barrister will easily expose the issues in their statement in cross-examination and can also deal with the statement of the lady down the road.

Dave]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226582#Comment_226582 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226582#Comment_226582 Sat, 04 Jul 2015 12:11:01 +0100 Mikeee5
I found out recently that My neighbours have paid the expert witness to comment on some videos that they have taken of the chimney smoking and answer some questions on his report. Perhaps he isn't allowed to attend court because he has now done work for both parties!]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226609#Comment_226609 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226609#Comment_226609 Sun, 05 Jul 2015 19:03:47 +0100 Mikeee5 Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226613#Comment_226613 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226613#Comment_226613 Sun, 05 Jul 2015 19:39:34 +0100 longjohn2 I thought all evidence was disclosed to the other party (and the court) before the case is heard. I would be inclined to ask your legal advisor. I think it would be unfair if the party sprung evidence on the day of the case. You would surely have a right to reply. The judge would most likely adjourn the case pending exchanging further evidence? Why would the other party not disclose all documents?
LJ2]]> Smoke Nuisance – is wood wood? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226616#Comment_226616 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9305&Focus=226616#Comment_226616 Sun, 05 Jul 2015 20:24:33 +0100 Mikeee5