Hi Guys,

I bought one of these (to be precise the SCP 560/6-1). It should last 40,000 hrs but has failed after just 3000 hrs.

http://eltaselect.com/products/axial/compact-scp.html#specifications

It is a large (as in up to 2m3/sec) extractor fan that sits in a bespoke made 'chimney' at the top of my stair well. It extracts large volumes of air during the summer when the outside air temp is below my indoor air temp (bringing cool air in through all the doors and windows) and it is a massive success. I live in Italy, as I type outside air temp is 37 deg. It is mounted horizontally, with the motor down (ie extracts) and run from a transformer speed controller. Only solution is a new motor at £150 plus carriage to Italy. It is 2.5 years old. I rang Elta where a techie suggested that it was better run at full speed (but conceded that it was specified that it would be fine on a speed controller); he then said it was better vertically mounted (but conceded that it was specified that it could run at any angle); he then said it was designed to be run continuously whereas mine runs 12 hrs a day for 3 months of the year and is then switched off for 9 months but also said that as it was fitted motor down all the grease would fall the 'right' way.

What a bxxch! What do people think? Is it a one-off failure? Would it be OK run for 5 minutes every day apart from the summer? What recourse might I have - is it fit for purpose? I must buy another one and see what happens as would another fan be any different anyway and then there is my chimney to adapt! I have not approached my supplier yet (Elta don't sell direct). Clearly some sort of letter is needed.

I bought the fan in the UK - it is v difficult to access choice let alone competitive pricing in Italy, and virtually impossible as a consumer/end user/DIYer. The bearings are 'sealed for life' and when I enquired whether there was a part I could replace I was told it would have to be the whole motor. Any idea whether the discontinuous use thing is relevant; it does sound plausible.

Gotanewlife:

Elta are a good brand for large industrial fans and I have been specifying them for some years, up to 1200 diameter, with no reported failures.

Most of these use speed control and do not run continuously, so the 'not continuously running' excuse seems rather feeble and appears to have been made by someone lacking in the necessary technical knowledge. However, all fans should be regularly exercised, at least weekly, to prevent bearing damage which is one of the most frequent causes of premature failure.

I assume it is out of warranty?

Posted By: Peter_in_HungaryThe consumer regs are the ones in force in the country of purchase

Posted By: GotanewlifeI bought the fan in the UK

In the UK you have six years (Sale of Goods Act). For the first 6 months the onus is on the supplier to prove you broke the equipment. After six months, it is up to you to prove that the equipment is faulty, rather than that you broke it or it reasonably wore out.

http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/sale-of-goods/understanding-the-sale-of-goods-act/your-rights/

Thanks all.

It is definitely the bearings, as when it starts it runs normally for a minute or few then the dreadful tortured wine starts then immediately after turning it off, I can rotate the fan manually ie just a few revs and get the same sound.

Posted By: GaryBHowever, all fans should be regularly exercised, at least weekly, to prevent bearing damage which is one of the most frequent causes of premature failure.

Thanks GaryB I guess you have hit the nail on the head there. I was sold this by a dealer who bought into my plan and enjoyed solving my problem; accordingly he fully understood how I would use it. I am sure that very very few DIYers, domestic users buy this sort of fan and therefore, since commercial users/professional installers know their stuff, they don't write on the instructions "exercise fan once a week or else". I will buy another motor and try to get him to sell it to me at below RRP at the same time asking his advice re exercise and gently gently seeing if he will say something I can hold him to next time (if there is a next time). Going in hard is always a long shot.

Exercising it will be a bugger though as during the winter the hole under the fan is filled with insulation. Fortunately there is enough room in the purpose made square cowl to raise the fan enough for some air to flow in through the lower vertical louvres and get out through the higher louvres as well as circulate within the cowl. Do-able but a bugger.

So how about 5 mins every day GaryB long enough, frequent enough? for best results. And on full whack or just enough to get everything warmed up and moving

If its the bearings gone - then replace them, probably up to about 10 quid each depending on size and quality. Its usually quite easy to dismantle an electric motor, take the bearings out (they are in the end plates) and take them to a shop that sells such things and purchase good quality replacements. If you don't feel up to the job then take the motor to a washing machine repair shop ( a family business who repairs on site would be best) and ask them to replace to bearings. They should have experience in this work due to replacing bearings in washing machine motors and then charging the client for a new motor!!

I would have thought running the motor a couple of times a week through the idle period would be enough. You probably don't need air flow, just the motor turning so providing nothing can touch or get sucked into the blades it might not be necessary to move anything. Check for over heating the first couple of times if don't remove the insulation. If you are going to do this with some frequency its probably worth setting up the insulation so that you can just switch on without disturbing anything.

Posted By: GaryB However, all fans should be regularly exercised, at least weekly, to prevent bearing damage which is one of the most frequent causes of premature failure.

Maybe I've lead a sheltered life, but I've never heard of bearings (ball, presumably?) being damaged by NOT running. How does this damage occur?

Edit: I know it is advised for aircon pumps maybe once a month, but that's a special circumstance.

Posted By: chuckeySquealing bearings ? Gain access to them and flood them with your favorite oil. rotate the impeller and flood more oil in to flush out the dust.

Earlier in the post there was a quote from the manufacture "sealed for life". I presume this means the bearings. In my experience 'sealed for life' means when the grease runs out - thats the end of their life! The act of replinshing the lubricant in this type of bearing will invariably result in damage to the seal and lead to more frequent loss of lube. In any event if bearings are seizing and making ugly sounds then damage has already occurred and they should be replaced. Re-lubing will only provide a temporary fix.
If bearings are replaced when trouble is first noticed then you should never get the situation where there was so much play in the bearings that the motor rotor/fan blades actually knocked on some part of the fixed casing.

Posted By: mike7Maybe I've lead a sheltered life, but I've never heard of bearings (ball, presumably?) being damaged by NOT running. How does this damage occur?

If some of the lubrication has leaked away then a long stationary period can find the remaining lube has, under gravity, fallen to the bottom of the housing and the working surfaces will be running dry until the lube gets where its needed by being pushed around. Also machines left inactive for too long can seize up due to dirt ingress or rust accumulation (caused by humidity and temperature changes) Occasional running avoids these problems.
How often do you hear ' It was alright when I last used it why won't it work now!'

There are lots of companies like:

http://www.bearingtraders.com/

who should be able to supply replacement bearings of any sort given a few dimensions of your existing ones.

(Only mention those as I used to walk past their High Wycombe place quite often. A few people I know use them as their first port of call for this sort of thing.)

Removing bearings is normally easy at the front (fan) end and may be a bit tricky at the back. The front end bearing can be accessed from both sides so its fairly simple to tap out in the opposite direction to which it was inserted. (Usually remove from outside to inside)
The other end can be a bit tricky sometimes as the bearing is often housed in a blind hole in the back plate. This means that it can not be tapped out from behind. The solution I have used in the past is to get a bar or spindle (or bolt) that JUST fits into the bearing i.e. the same diameter as the motor shaft or just a tiny bit smaller. You fill the bearing and housing with thin grease or thick oil, support the rear of the housing on something firm, insert the bar/shaft/bolt into the bearing and give the bar a good wack with a hammer. Hitting the bar creates a hydraulic lock and the resulting pressure will push the bearing out from behind. A good 'just fit' is important because if the bar is tight then the bearing will not slide out and if it is loose then you get oil all over yourself and the ceiling. This method works with bushes and sealed bearings.