Green Building Forum - Is Hinkley C dead? Mon, 14 Sep 2026 16:07:35 +0100 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/ Lussumo Vanilla 1.0.3 Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246100#Comment_246100 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246100#Comment_246100 Mon, 22 Aug 2016 09:49:23 +0100 djh Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246154#Comment_246154 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246154#Comment_246154 Wed, 24 Aug 2016 17:51:45 +0100 John Daglish
Wind energy is a fuel $aver and constructing an energy system around variable or cycling (such as tidal lagoon) renewables is not an insurmountable problem as indicated by many reports from all around the world and as in the recent Royal Academy of Engineering report ;
http://www.raeng.org.uk/news/releases/shownews.htm?NewsID=925

High renewable scenarios from around the world
http://www.mng.org.uk/gh/scenarios.htm

Denmark Smart Energy Systems: 100% Renewable Energy by 2050 (video)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1P31EC0YsE
tech presentation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-sDkrZmrUA

Renewables, nuclear, or fossil fuels? Scenarios for Great Britain’s power system considering costs, emissions and energy security Imperial College Pfenninger & Keirstead
http://blog.environmentalresearchweb.org/2015/07/25/uk-renewables-can-get-to-80-or-more/

The Fraunhofer 2050 REMod-D high renewables model shows no cost penalty.
https://workspace.imperial.ac.uk/climatechange/Public/pdfs/presentations/solar%202050/Solar-2050_2014-01_Henning.pdf

The only problem are existing vested interests, supine politicians and poorly briefed journalists. The grid needs restructuring for the coming renewable energy revolution. We certainly do not need over complicated, high cost, inflexible and high risk nuclear. In fact current nuclear proposals will block investment in renewables after 2020, locking the UK into the high cost nuclear cycle.

When you have variable renewable, base load generation is redundant, you need quick reacting infill such as already existing gas fired CCGT Combined Cycle Gas Turbine and OCT Open Cycle gas Turbine (perhaps fuel cells in the future if they scale). We will need this anyway when a nuclear has a unintended shutdown. This will be relatively low cost with occasional use (give them capacity payments if need or just let the state buy them cheap) and well below C02 emission targets. The ramp up and down rates are similar to existing rates and extra maintenance costs are minimal.

With some CO2 capture and use of biomass + coal you can even have low to neutral CO2 emissions. BECCS biogenic carbon capture and storage (and use). CO2 then has an economic value.
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201213/cmselect/cmenergy/529/529we10.htm
http://decarbonizingfires.com/Heating%20Gas%20-%20Carbon-neutral%20Heating%20Gas.pdf

Base load is redundant (and puts the fear of God into the big 6)
www.energyscience.org.au/BP16%20BaseLoad.pdf

First reduce demand with a roll out of energy efficiency.

Storing potential electrical energy is high cost with diminishing returns in round trip efficiency.

Better to use other storage vectors that are lower cost first in an energy systems approach, then use higher cost but valuable electrical storage with short to long term storage capacities and availabilities as needed eg District Heating (using MW heat pumps on HV grid with inter-seasonal low cost storage), pumped hydro electric, batteries, cryogenic heat engines, P2G renewable power to gas has lower efficiency so one of the last port of calls but it is easily and cheaply stored and can be used for long periods in great quantity, etc.

JRC District Heating report
http://setis.ec.europa.eu/system/files/JRCDistrictheatingandcooling.pdf

see 4th generation District Heating low temperature 60-50C supply/ 30-20 return with large area surface emitters eg wall or floor heating
www.4dh.dk

Lots of interesting new renewable developments in the pipeline
eg prototype osmotic power station using high saline geothermal district heating water in Denmark

https://stateofgreen.com/en/news/salt-power-to-produce-co2-neutral-electricity
https://issuu.com/saltpower/docs/saltpowerbrochure-4-2016

solar photovoltaic + batteries - perhaps but not good economies of scale or use of resources, congestion? More public transport and trams better eg Trampower www.trampower.co.uk]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246162#Comment_246162 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246162#Comment_246162 Wed, 24 Aug 2016 19:26:34 +0100 Gotanewlife Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246165#Comment_246165 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246165#Comment_246165 Wed, 24 Aug 2016 19:46:29 +0100 ringi Posted By: John Daglishsolar photovoltaic + batteries - perhaps but not good economies of scale or use of resources,

Works well, but not for the UK! Great if you are somewhere with sun most of the year and a lot of AC load..]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246167#Comment_246167 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246167#Comment_246167 Wed, 24 Aug 2016 20:51:13 +0100 Nick Parsons
Ed davies wrote:

''Posted By: ringi
believe that drying in the name of god''

drying up?

Are Nick and I the only ones who find Ringi's typos a source of humour? Or do others just not notice?''

Is this about praying that your washing dries before it rains?]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246579#Comment_246579 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=246579#Comment_246579 Sat, 03 Sep 2016 18:17:31 +0100 fostertom https://www.amazon.co.uk/Switch-solar-storage-means-cheap/dp/1781256357/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1472922777&sr=8-1&keywords=the+switch+chris+goodall
it had seemed Mrs M was alert to the new situation and it was all over for Hinkley.

Now not so sure - looks more like just a suspense tactic to bargain with China. UK may be the v last country to commit to the biggest ball-and-chain ever, just before everyone else sees sense.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247071#Comment_247071 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247071#Comment_247071 Thu, 15 Sep 2016 11:13:39 +0100 fostertom https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/sep/15/hinkley-point-c-nuclear-power-station-gets-go-ahead]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247075#Comment_247075 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247075#Comment_247075 Thu, 15 Sep 2016 11:41:37 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247107#Comment_247107 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247107#Comment_247107 Fri, 16 Sep 2016 08:55:16 +0100 fostertom https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/picture/2016/sep/15/steve-bell-on-hinkley-point-c-cartoon]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247115#Comment_247115 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247115#Comment_247115 Fri, 16 Sep 2016 09:53:42 +0100 Gotanewlife
Her hands were tied, she won some concessions. I will not judge her.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247125#Comment_247125 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247125#Comment_247125 Fri, 16 Sep 2016 11:00:58 +0100 fostertom Posted By: Gotanewlifeit is the lesser of 2 evilsspell those out?]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247126#Comment_247126 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247126#Comment_247126 Fri, 16 Sep 2016 11:14:56 +0100 Gotanewlife Posted By: fostertomspell those out?
Evil Choice 1: Hinkley C

Evil Choice 2:
Posted By: Gotanewlifenot have Chinese (specifically) but mega investment from other countries due to our unreliability etc

Yours perplexed?]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247129#Comment_247129 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247129#Comment_247129 Fri, 16 Sep 2016 11:40:18 +0100 Ed Davies https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/15/the-guardian-view-on-hinkley-point-c-hard-choice-wrong-call]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247133#Comment_247133 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=247133#Comment_247133 Fri, 16 Sep 2016 13:09:14 +0100 atomicbisf
Talking of China and electricity generation, just been reading some reportage from China:-

Thermal (fossil fuel, basically coal) generation 96 TWh lower in 2015 than 2014, hydro 44 TWh up, solar 43 TWh up, nuclear 35 TWh up, wind 29 TWh up.

https://cleantechnica.com/2016/09/15/latest-trends-chinas-continuing-renewable-energy-revolution/

Ed]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=249817#Comment_249817 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=249817#Comment_249817 Thu, 10 Nov 2016 20:28:06 +0000 Ed Davies http://www.ecowatch.com/france-nuclear-power-shut-down-2086414462.html

“A third of France's nuclear reactors have been shut down by industry regulators as revelations emerge about the supply of sub-standard parts.

As investigations into falsified documents and excess quantities of carbon in steel continue, more closures are expected. This is not yet a full-blown crisis for the nuclear industry, but it is putting serious strain on the finances of French nuclear giant EDF and causing electricity price rises across western Europe. …”]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=249829#Comment_249829 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=249829#Comment_249829 Thu, 10 Nov 2016 23:07:13 +0000 SteamyTea There was also something about the Chinese and Hinkley.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=308600#Comment_308600 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=308600#Comment_308600 Tue, 17 Jun 2025 00:17:05 +0100 stonecold
Insulating and moving to more solar PV in business and domestic would be a far better use of the money. How is it that our energy use as a country goes ip every year?

Who or what is the reason?

Windfarms cancelled too.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=308609#Comment_308609 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=308609#Comment_308609 Tue, 17 Jun 2025 10:55:22 +0100 sgt_woulds
The only limitation with renewables is grid stability (frequency, which could be ensured with distributed modular flywheel storage) and power storage for low production days (chemical storage, gravity batteries, sand batteries, redox flow batteries, etc, etc).

Distributed and independent technologies on the grid would provide the security and redundancy that would truly make the UK immune from price shocks and foreign shenanigans and, (increasingly likely) war damage.

But then the Government would connect them all with Chinese 5G...]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=308612#Comment_308612 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=308612#Comment_308612 Tue, 17 Jun 2025 12:13:23 +0100 Artiglio The modern developed world uses huge amounts of energy, people don’t want to go backwards. The UK is living well beyond its means in so many areas it’s totally unsustainable. At some point economic reality will bite. The net zero goal will be an easy way to reduce costs if its scaled back.
Love or Loath nuclear, it’s a solution to our energy needs upon which we can rely. If the UK could actually build in sensible timescales instead of tying itself in endless knots it’d be a solution in the near future, but it won’t be. Expensive yes, but in terms of long term benefit will seem a bargain in contrast to HS2.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311006#Comment_311006 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311006#Comment_311006 Thu, 16 Jul 2026 16:54:23 +0100 wholaa Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311007#Comment_311007 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311007#Comment_311007 Thu, 16 Jul 2026 17:22:22 +0100 fostertom Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311010#Comment_311010 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311010#Comment_311010 Fri, 17 Jul 2026 08:59:53 +0100 WillInAberdeen
By chance, this July is both the twentieth anniversary of the 2006 government Energy Review that proposed building Hinkley C, and the tenth anniversary of the 2016 Final Decision to start full construction work. Finished by the thirtieth anniversary in 2036, perhaps?

People joke about how fusion power is only twenty years away and always has been, but seems like old-fashioned fission power is now only thirty years away!]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311015#Comment_311015 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311015#Comment_311015 Fri, 17 Jul 2026 10:23:36 +0100 sgt_woulds
My last comment from 2025 still stands. Can't remember what I might have said back in 2016...!


Imagine if they spent the money on sand battery storage instead.

But energy security was never the point of Hinkley. They need it to continue supply of depleted uraniam munitions.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311052#Comment_311052 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311052#Comment_311052 Tue, 21 Jul 2026 11:57:10 +0100 fostertom
Reminds me of my aero-modeling (or was it slot-racing?) days, when a small lead nose-weight was incorporated to adjust fore-aft balance; someone wrote in to say why not use aluminium instead, would save so much weight.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311053#Comment_311053 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311053#Comment_311053 Tue, 21 Jul 2026 16:37:50 +0100 owlman
Now that large-scale grid forming inverters are available it is even less necessary to build a new spinning mass just to maintain grid stability.


I often listen to Kathryn Porter on this subject of grid stability, and other power related subjects, she's worth a listen. Last I heard from her she has suspicions that the Spanish grid failure had frequency instability as its prime cause, plus a couple of worrying grid frequency issues here in the UK.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311054#Comment_311054 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311054#Comment_311054 Tue, 21 Jul 2026 16:45:44 +0100 owlman As IUI the Army only use DU ammunition in the UK for test firings and only then at 2 ranges,- not Dartmoor.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311059#Comment_311059 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311059#Comment_311059 Tue, 21 Jul 2026 18:36:31 +0100 fostertom Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311063#Comment_311063 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311063#Comment_311063 Tue, 21 Jul 2026 20:51:41 +0100 djh Posted By: owlmanNow that large-scale grid forming inverters are available it is even less necessary to build a new spinning mass just to maintain grid stability.


I often listen to Kathryn Porter on this subject of grid stability, and other power related subjects, she's worth a listen. Last I heard from her she has suspicions that the Spanish grid failure had frequency instability as its prime cause, plus a couple of worrying grid frequency issues here in the UK.Hmm ...

AIUI the first large-scale grid-forming validation test was completed just a few months ago, and is expensive, so while the technology may exist it's in no state yet for wide scale roll-out.

I often read Kathryn Porter's articles too, and think she speaks a lot of sense as in the examples you mention. But in some ways she has her thinking backwards. She seems to think that getting off fossil-powered generation is extremely difficult (she may be right) and is not economic (probably right again) and therefore we should carry on building fossil-powered generation (she misses the fundamental nature of the climate crisis, IMHO).

Anyway, her latest article is about the added cost of providing duplicate fossil-powered generation to back up solar and wind in the event of a period of hot, still weather. She makes the relevant point that batteries are too expensive for grid-forming inverters to make sense, but apparently has not heard of the idea of storing green hydrogen in salt caverns and burning that when required.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311065#Comment_311065 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311065#Comment_311065 Tue, 21 Jul 2026 21:32:07 +0100 WillInAberdeen
https://www.desmog.com/2023/06/22/climate-sceptic-goes-unchallenged-on-bbcs-today-programme/


Many fossil industry people tried to suggest the Spanish blackout was something to do with frequency and lack of fossil generators (spinning mass), and by implication too much renewable electricity. But, being an incident on the European combined grid, it was investigated by a team from many EU countries who thoroughly debunked the frequency instability story. The actual problem was with voltage control.

The regular scare stories they keep putting out about 'near disaster ' in the UK grid have also not stood scrutiny.



It's actually quite alarming how the UK political consensus on renewables has been abandoned in favour of US style culture-wars, with the fossil-fuel parties using the electricity grid to bash the renewable-energy parties and vv. As recently as the last election, politicians on both sides were following the science/engineering, (anyone remember Boris 's CoP 26 in Glasgow?) but now they have surrounded themselves with paid consultants to write partisan stuff they can launch at the opposition. Basic utilities shouldn't be a political football imo, nor should climate.]]> Is Hinkley C dead? https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311069#Comment_311069 https://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=14100&Focus=311069#Comment_311069 Wed, 22 Jul 2026 11:18:42 +0100 owlman
I think Kathryn Porter agrees its voltage that was the problem. She says:-

"The grid operator forgot that inertia applies to voltage as well as frequency but unlike frequency varies with location
Allowing conventional synchronous generation in the south to close, relying on plant in the north and east was a big mistake
Now they can't keep the southern grid stable and face more blackouts "]]>