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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

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  1.  
    i have bought some unused but old timber window frames cheaply. they are made by premdor and supposedly for 20mmm units. they are i think basecoat stained but this is worn and scratched in places. I want to use them and understand from discussions here that linseed oil paint is the best thing to use, can this be used without removing the basecoat, would i need to sand them ? I also understand tha a 20mm unit isn't as good as a 24mm unit. could i fit a 24mm unit anyway perhaps cuting down the wooden beads that are suplied if nescerry ? is it worth it? I gather that krypton gas would improve the proformance of a 20mm unit how much more expensive is it and is it worth it?
    i'm on a very tight budget so have no chance of affrording new scandinavian tripleglazed windows or anything but still want to do the the best i can. so your advice would be welcome.
    by the way the building i am doing counts as a mobile home and therefore does not need to comply with building regulations.
  2.  
    Yes, I'd use real linseed oil paint. A can from Holkhams seems expensive to buy but remember that it goes a lot further - maybe double a typical alkyd resin paint so over 20 m2 per litre as opposed to 12 m2. Brush it out as thinly as you can. It will last much longer too so in the long run will prove to be the cheapest paint. Ideally. one uses a coat of linseed oil on bare wood and then the paint but in your case I'd just apply the paint over the 'basecoat' that is already there.

    A 20mm unit is not quite as good as 24 but add thick curtains and you wont notice the difference. I suspect that the cost of krypton fill may be greater than the curtains so may not be worth bothering with. Cutting down the wooden beads may not be too clever - you don't want to add to the risk of sealed unit failure.
    • CommentAuthorjamesingram
    • CommentTimeMay 8th 2008 edited
     
    argon gas fill is about £6m2 +vat
    and gives a potential decreased U value of between 0.1 - 0.2 W/m2K

    draught proofing them well , would be better and quite cheap to achieve
  3.  
    The firm that makes my units always do argon fill as standard - no extra cost. Shop around! (I think the benefit may be greater than those figures, James.)
    • CommentAuthorjoe.e
    • CommentTimeMay 9th 2008
     
    How wide is the existing beading? If there's plenty of extra width, it probably wouldn't hurt to cut it down to allow you to use thicker units. Alternatively, would the section of the frames allow routing out a little extra rebate depth? Thicker units are more or less free extra insulation, so it would be worth a bit of work to fit them.
    •  
      CommentAuthorrogerwhit
    • CommentTimeMay 9th 2008
     
    2 or 3 mm bedding (glazing tape) + sealed units + min 10mm seating for beads. Work out unit thickness from that. Pilot drilling beads with 1.5mm holes may help avoid splitting, but is pointless if (as many glaziers do) you use a nail gun. Silicone the units in, OR vent the rebates to outside at the bottom.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeMay 9th 2008
     
    Don't we agree that siliconing-in, as is most often done, is the main 'cause' of DG unit failure? A DG unit is much happier for longer in a dry-glazed drained situation. As rogerwhit says, use two 1mm or 1.5mm dry glazing pressure tapes, no mastic, and work on the assumption that a little water and/or air pressure may sometimes enter the rebate space, so make sure it can drain and ventilate out the bottom - either by drillings up through the bottom rail or ideally via an aluminium e.g. Exitex bottom bead. This all adds even more to the required rebate depth. You can make do with slimmed-down glazing beads, or as suggested above, machine out a bit more rebate depth. The inner 'fence' could probably go down to 10mm.
  4.  
    I used the Holkham paint last summer and would do so again. However, I'd leave a few days between coats and, as Biff suggests, brush it out thinly. I did 3 coats in 3 days, and it didn't seem to dry properly for weeks leading to the casements getting stuck, having to touch up etc. Remember to use shellac on the knots.
    • CommentAuthorjoe.e
    • CommentTimeMay 9th 2008
     
    I strongly second what fostertom says above about dry glazing versus silicon for DG units. Dry glazing tape and a carefully arranged vented rebate is very much best practice, especially with timber frames. To facilitate venting, you want the unit to be a little bit smaller all round than a tight fit - depending on the rebate and beading, maybe order them a minimum of 5mm smaller than the tight fit size in both dimensions, ie. 2.5mm gap all around, with the unit stood on 2.5mm spacers. A bigger gap is better if circumstances allow, but the glazing tape needs to be seated on glass and not onto the edging tape of the DG unit.
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