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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

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  1.  
    I am currently renovating a ground floor flat where the 200 year old limestone walled building has no DPC. There are historic solid concrete floors that will reman. The plan is to use lime plaster throughout (having hacked of the cement based render that has blown in many places).

    The walls are 500 mm thick and are limestone/rubble construction.

    Where possible EWI will be used, unfortunately due to boundary issues one side will have to be IWI. The plan would be to have a parge coat of lime plaster, then what would be the safe makeup for the IWI ?

    The IWI should be the minimum thickness reasonable as internal space is at a premium. There are no U values that have to be achieved to satisfy regulations, I am just looking for a good option that will avoid condensation and consequential mould. The flat will be rented so proper control of ventilation (and therefore RH) will be difficult.

    Insulated plasterboard is not a real option as it is not readily available here.

    Should any battens be timber or would galvanised steel battens be a better option. Timber treated against insect attack is available but other treatments are not.
    • CommentAuthorwookey
    • CommentTimeSep 2nd 2024 edited
     
    Woodfibre with a lime plaster is good for these sorts of historic walls with no DPC. 20-80mm depending on space and moisture load. There are several vendors of suitable boards. No idea what is available in Hungary, but the manufacturers I am aware of are in Poland (Beltermo, Steico), Germany (Gutex, Steico (HQ), Udidammsystem), France (Pavatex, Steico), Norway (Hunton).

    You can get boards with a squishy back for irregular walls (Udireco) but normally you parge the wall first to get it vaguely planar, then glue the boards on. UdiNF are relatively small in order to flex a bit for irregular walls.

    80mm is generally reckoned to be as thick as you want to go on single-skin walls of unknown dampness. 60mm is playing it a bit safer. But even 40mm will make it much nicer.

    I've seen 80mm put on a sandstone historic building (sandstone block, rubble, brick inner ~400mm thick) and that worked very nicely, even when they had a massive internal gutter leak saturating the wall and woodfibre for a month or two: It dried out again remarkably quickly (once the hole was unbunged) and nothing bad happened to the wall surfaces (which I think is an excellent illustration of how robust a system this is).
    • CommentAuthorrevor
    • CommentTimeSep 2nd 2024
     
    I would avoid battens of any sort even galvanised are not proper galvanising. Do you need a fine finish internally?. I would look at use cork panels, come in a variety of thickness and easy to fit with the adhesive after levelling the wall as best one cane with a lime parge coat.

    https://www.lime.org.uk/products/boards-backgrounds-insulation/cork-boards/expanded-cork-insulation-system.html

    I used cork on the outside to extend my ewi to below the bottom of my internal floor insulation. I decided to leave it un-finished and it works good. A plain cork board will be warm and will acts as a feature. I don't know if you can get your hands on cork panels but I think they are available throughout Europe. ISOVIT the make of panel is Portuguese.
  2.  
    I take the point about battens but without battens how can the VCL be fixed to the warm side of the insulation and then plasterboard (or other finish) be fixed?

    Cork would fail in this situation, one on price, way more expensive than EPS and the other problem is that if it is left as a feature (nice idea) it would not be robust enough to withstand e.g. the tenants puppy brought in against the house rules or the errant child who decides it would be fun to pick bits out of the wall
    • CommentAuthorwookey
    • CommentTimeSep 14th 2024
     
    Posted By: Peter_in_HungaryI take the point about battens but without battens how can the VCL be fixed to the warm side of the insulation and then plasterboard (or other finish) be fixed?


    Which is why the woodfibre system is no nice - you don't need a VCL. So you don't need battens, so the whole thing really is just (parge if too wonky) fix boards to wall, plaster it.
    • CommentAuthorstonecold
    • CommentTimeSep 22nd 2024
     
    We are in a similar situation with one wall, although on a house. Regarding boundary issues you are entitled to access via your neighbour's property/curtledge to maintain the outside (free Party Wall agreement) ie you can replace roughcast if needed or remove a band 300mm or so high and replace with thin XPS plinth then re-render to keep out water if it's needed (just done this for our wall which is right on a road that often has water running down it. XPS was suggested by Ecological Building Systems- the Diathonite supplier- the inside of this wall is below ground and obviously no floor insulation and plaster inside is blown.

    If you want the walls to be able to breathe (vapour open) as lime does then the exterior render needs to be breathable ie not cement render ... for this internally you will need to level the walls to avoid having air gaps behind IWI, diathonite thermactive is both insulating and suitable for levelling and it's lime based. No need for battens.

    Insulation is either flexible eg cornerstone insulating plaster or if you can afford it aerogel (there's an aerogel plaster product - https://www.backtoearth.co.uk/product/super-insulating-aerogel-plaster-fixit-222/ - and you can get Aerogel Wallboard which has battens built-in), or alternatively you use rigid boards eg Wood like Gutex or Lime Green's Warm Shell. On top of that you need either a "breathable" plasterboard or lime plaster- hence suggesting cornerstone insulated plaster, PLUS breathable primer and breathable paint suited to lime. If you want fairly thick insulated eg layers of Diathonite then there's a mesh needed but it's simple to do. Everything going into the wall will need special thermally broken fixings instead of metal screws. Often that means radiator fixings, electric cupboard or meter, skirting board can be fixed with adhesive at least. If you use boards then an airtight but vapour open membrane is an option, but Diathonite acts as an airtight layer.

    Ecological Building Systems have IWI documentation for the Lime Green Warm Shell wood IWI and also sell Diathonite Thermactive (which is more insulating than the wood), they will do the thermal calculations for you too.

    Basically going this way, you are looking at no vapour barrier but the bottom of the wall will need treating to keep the damp out. Diathonite actually do a bunch of options, including some for walls affected by salts. Details are a bit lacking but case study of a damp cottage treated with Diathonite IWI: https://www.ecologicalbuildingsystems.com/document/download/504

    Planning for treatment around any windows to avoid cold bridges is needed too.

    It is quite a number of different products layered together but relatively simple/familiar for lime specialists to apply (and quote for).
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