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Housing - New Build: Whats the best flat roofing material for under a 'green' roof...?

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  1.  
    GRP...you know the Polyroof type stuff...

    EPDM - DIY able but shrinkage...?

    Good old fashioned felt...

    Thermoplastic?

    J
  2.  
    ...mmmh... rather disappointing response...

    :sad:
  3.  
    From "green building handbook V2 " printed 2000
    on flat roofs
    "best buy
    1. pitch roof
    2. EPMD , or natural rubber
    3. modified bitumen felt
    avoid PVC,Chlorinated polyethylene

    polyester resin and glass fibre mat scores badly for ozone depletion,acid rain,occupational health,recycling/reuse/disposal
    glass fibre felt performed worst for durability of all tested flat roof systems ,particularly at low temperatures
    durability is roughly related to price , budjet products are not recommmended"

    hope this is of some help

    Jim
  4.  
    Cheers Jim,

    Surprised about the durability bit though had always assumed it to be pretty bomb proof...

    J :sad:
    •  
      CommentAuthorrichy
    • CommentTimeJul 11th 2009
     
    whats worse? GRP roofing using local components or natural slates quarried and shipped over from Spain or China?
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeJul 12th 2009
     
    I have a feeling that the resins used contain high levels of organic chlorine which is not good especially in a fire or on disposal.
  7.  
    Posted By: tonyI have a feeling that the resins used contain high levels of organic chlorine
    GRP resins do not contain chlorine - they're polyester based. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyester_resin

    Paul in Montreal.
  8.  
    Shamelessly changing the name of hte thread from 'whats the environmnetal impact of GRP roofing'...

    thought I'd open it up...

    -performance
    -cost
    -durability

    -all balanced against environmental impact good old back of beermat LCA type thing

    J

    PS If this thread get hijacked by a bunch of "you should have a pitched thatched roof or one with recycled slates etc", I'll not be happy...
  9.  
    1. pitch roof
    2. EPMD , or natural rubber
    3. modified bitumen felt

    I guess this must be a good guide as mentioned above ,
    'Jon' posted some good stuff on a previous thread , he'd be the guy to ask.
    • CommentAuthorRoger
    • CommentTimeJul 13th 2009
     
    Shallow incline - Sedum roof?
  11.  
    ...but what underneath to keep the water out Roger...?

    J
  12.  
    What about a Walter Segal Flooded roof?! Takes out all the expansion and contraction, doesn't collapse your house unless the overflow gets blocked, and I gather he did it with built-up felt. Takes faith....

    ...and you could have fish...
  13.  
    ...as in provide upstands, let it fill with water and use the pool which forms as thermal buffering sort of thing to protect the felt...

    J
  14.  
    Yep!
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeJul 13th 2009
     
    I took apart a flat roof built by a builder 65 years after he did it -- it was amazing

    All he did was lay one layer of felt on the roofing boards ( non t & g), and cover it with 40mm of 10mm shingle -- there was an zinc retainer at the very edge.

    60 years no rot no hassel not expensive either. the "flat roof " did have a fall of 1 in 40.
  16.  
    Combining Nick and Tony's input... s'pose that shows the huge benefit of protecting the membrane whatever it is..

    ..good job the one in question is going under a 'green' roof... only downside to that is of course if there is a leak...

    ...feel another change of title coming on...
    • CommentAuthorJulian
    • CommentTimeJul 14th 2009
     
    Roofkrete James. Have used it and it's excellent. Can be used under green roofs successfully. Seamless, thin, durable.
  18.  
    James,

    I am not sure I want my input 'combed'. Now my beard, that's another thing.....
  19.  
    edited...
  20.  
    Roofkrete eh.... now where did I hear that name...
  21.  
    ...wasn't there a bloke who wanted to sell it that kept going on and on about it on this forum until it was explained that that was advertising....

    However shouldn't tar the whole lot with the same brush (little roofing joke there...? eh...? eh..?)...

    So Roofkrete then... only info I can find is that it is apparently the best thing since sliced bread unfortunately this comes from the manufacturers... so would be good to hear more of your experiences Julian...?

    (or any other experiences to the contrary...)

    J
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeJul 14th 2009
     
    Yes, Roofkrete - much overlooked and underrated. Versatile, strong, resilient, seamless, hugely reinforced against cracking.
  23.  
    Who says...?

    And what actually is it...?

    J
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeJul 14th 2009
     
    It's reinforced conc 6mm thick reinf with multiple layers of fine square-mesh bound with very carefully graded fine-aggregate/cement. It's ferro-concrete yacht construction taken to a much higher level. A 40mm wide strip of it behaves much like a strip of spring steel - it bends quite a bit and returns to shape without even hairline cracks. Much description here http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=174 (ASMET is same stuff as Roofkrete). Unfortunately John Manniex its inventor died recently but his family in co-operation with Oxford Brookes is mounting a fresh campaign to develop and market uses for this amazing material.
    • CommentAuthorcookie
    • CommentTimeJul 14th 2009
     
    I am planning on Sarna single ply membrane for the one I'm doing in a few months, but would appreciate any more environmentally friendlier options... Sarna lasts a bloomin long time.

    Cookie
    • CommentAuthorJulian
    • CommentTimeJul 15th 2009 edited
     
    James,

    Exactly as Tom describes. He should know he's been to the HQ.

    If you are ever in East Devon email me and come and have a look at it in use. Good for green roofs, balconies, flat roofs. Very cost effective and low cement content*. You can lap it over everything so no joins or seams.

    *Compared to materials with a much higher cement content!
    • CommentAuthorRobinB
    • CommentTimeJul 15th 2009
     
    So, does anyone know the answer to the thread's original question? Sarna? EPDM? Sounds as if Roofkrete may not be commercially available at present.
    Robin
  28.  
    . Very cost effective and low cement content*. You can lap it over everything so no joins or seams.

    *Compared to materials with a much higher cement content!



    Ive been try to find out teh ingredients of Roofkrete to get an idea of its eco credentials, toxicity etc
    anyone know? or is it a trade secret?


    The site looks impressive except for the photo of the grinning reptile on the home page
    • CommentAuthorJulian
    • CommentTimeJul 15th 2009
     
    Hi Bot,
    Trade Secret sums it up nicely. Even the contactors who install it don't know the exact ingredients. Good luck trying to find out!

    It claims to have contain only a small proportion of cement and even then it is as Tom said very thin. So a little goes a long way. As toxic as sand and cement usually is?
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeJul 15th 2009
     
    My guess is there isn't really a secret - no clever chemicals anyway - just some expert sourcing, grading and quality control of the bagged cement/aggregate mix.

    Posted By: RobinBSounds as if Roofkrete may not be commercially available at present
    Certainly is.

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