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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

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  1.  
    Just heard on the news that Tilbury biomass power station is burning well. I cannot believe how they can get it so wrong as it is a well known fact that biomass is subject to spontaneous combustion and if you have any sense you make provision for this. We only store wet material in 1m3 containers.
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeFeb 27th 2012
     
    Want to take a bet on any lessons learnt? :wink:
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeFeb 27th 2012
     
    Been burning for several hours now. Wood pellets, so hardly wet material.
    Still it does not matter, only takes a year to grow the timber to make into pellets again :wink:
  2.  
    Just amazed how easy it was for them to get planning permission.

    http://www.thurrocktgdc.org.uk/swiftlg/apas/MediaTemp/-10507.pdf

    Life is so easy with big six cash
  3.  
    http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/business/business-news/drax_shows_abroad_outlook_on_pelleting_plants_1_4289216
    Drax apparently propose up to 5 pelleting plants in Nth and Sth America plus Canada, import to West UKports and transport to East Yorkshire for burning!!!. Tilbury fire will hopefully increase awareness of spontaneous combustion problem in biomass.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDamonHD
    • CommentTimeFeb 27th 2012
     
    Oil and gas has a spontaneous combustion problem, as does flour and custard powder.

    Yes, they screwed up, but that's not a unique biomass issue.

    Rgds

    Damon
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeFeb 27th 2012
     
    Flour and custard powder, eh? So after the fire brigade have sprayed it all with water you're left with one hell of a custard tart.:shocked:
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeFeb 27th 2012
     
    Posted By: DamonHDYes, they screwed up, but that's not a unique biomass issue.

    Just down the road from the is Shell Haven. It caught fire not once but twice. Lived nearby the second time (moved there because of the original fire) and 'all us kids' went to the top of Clay Hill, walked into the golf links and then watched the sky ablaze. Was an impressive sight. Did mean another year in Basildon though.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDamonHD
    • CommentTimeFeb 27th 2012
     
    Don't call me a tart, Joiner!
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeMar 4th 2012
     
    Damon - :bigsmile:

    Don't know how I missed that! :neutral:

    Anyway, seems our native stocks of timber don't only have biomass to worry about...

    http://uk.news.yahoo.com/200-ancient-woodlands-threatened-074239947.html

    ... or should biomass be worried about encroaching developments? :cry:
  4.  
    Woodlands are also threatened by Health and Safety. Just completed a job where all trees 10 mtrs either side of a public footpath had to be removed in case the trees fell onto the path and injured somebody.
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeMar 4th 2012
     
    Jeez, John. Madness.

    We only get the trees felled on the country park when they actually do start to look as if they've had it. A patch was felled only two weeks ago, but then we do have to be careful because it's all the reclaimed land of the old colliery workings, so root depth is virtually top-soil and whatever they can penetrate of the spoil heaps. It's why felled trees are left to rot. Because of the poor soil conditions, none of the mature trees could be called healthy. I'm usually calling the Ranger out to clear a tree that's fallen across a path!

    And the trees are alongside the footpaths!

    30 metres is a tad excessive. In fact I can't think of anything like that in the parts of the Wyre Forest we walk, so who thought that one up?
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeMar 5th 2012
     
    Here is an odd thing. Not what I have always thought.
    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/03/120302193928.htm
  5.  
    Steamy Tea

    Except, as usual with these things, it doesn't really give enough information - like the proportion of diesel to petrol engines - e.g. wouldn't be surprising if there's only 10% diesel, and also whether there are already disparate
    emission controls on the different engine types.
    • CommentAuthorMike.B
    • CommentTimeMar 8th 2012
     
    I have a real-world dilemma on this subject. There has been a lot of stimulating theoretical debate in this topic and if I were starting from scratch with a new build I would probably take a different route to heating my home than our existing house allows.

    We have no gas in our village, our 1960 house is currently heated by oil and we need to replace the boiler when we have completed a fairly large extension. We are open to 'green' suggestions for heating the house but these must be reasonably economic. As I see it, the practical choice is between a new oil boiler and a wood pellet boiler with automated feed. We are not prepared to fill it up every other day. The wood pellet boiler would only be cost-effective if the RHI is in fact introduced.

    Heat-pumps won't work for us as IMO they can only be worthwhile if you have under-floor heating and we don't.

    Propane is too expensive.

    We have already insulated the house as far as is reasonably practical.

    We're tending towards going for the wood pellet boiler despite the large investment and huge amount of space required, but I am interested in comments from the forum. We will only go for something that works well, is low maintenance, is cost effective and does not involve major changes to the existing house.

    Mike.
    • CommentAuthorSteveZ
    • CommentTimeMar 8th 2012
     
    We use an oil-fired boiler at the moment, but when it dies, I think I'll replace it with the 2-stage Daikin ASHP or whatever similar is around then. This will happily provide hot water for the radiators at 70°C and more. Seems like a reasonably green solution to me!
    • CommentAuthorpmusgrove
    • CommentTimeMar 8th 2012
     
    Mike.B; what about Solar? Have only had mine working for 3 weeks but am amazed by what it has been producing. Even if it is not enough to heat the house it can offer help to the oil boiler.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeMar 8th 2012
     
    You say "We have already insulated the house as far as is reasonably practical."

    What does this mean and and what are the economics looking like for more insulation vs savings in heating costs?
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeMar 8th 2012
     
    The consensus seems to be that if you don't have mains gas you have a Get Out Of Jail Free card. :wink:
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeMar 8th 2012 edited
     
    Insulate and draftproof, stick in some ST and PV if you can, HP (I personally prefer a GSHP, but an ASHP is better than pellets), use electric to top up, the grid is getting greener, al be it slowly but you can salivate that by timing your usage better.
    When you done all that put some more insulation in.
  6.  
    Just get a Lohberger pellet stove. Does the central heating, hot water and cooking and for good measure you can throw logs on it as well.
    • CommentAuthorCWatters
    • CommentTimeMar 9th 2012 edited
     
    Running cost comparison..
    http://www.nottenergy.com/energy_cost_comparison/
    Scroll down to the table and see "Pence per kWh (after boiler efficiency)"

    Note that GSHP and ASHP assume a low temperature heating system such as UFH. At least that's what they told me when I asked a few years back.
    • CommentAuthorMike.B
    • CommentTimeMar 9th 2012 edited
     
    As CWatters alludes, heat pumps are not very efficient at the output temperatures required for DHW and radiators. I'd downrate the estimated 250% efficiency for ASHP to something closer to 150% to get the output temperature up to the 55C - 65C you want for radiators. GSHP is a bit better as the input temperature is higher when you need it most, but still not great. If we did have UFH, I would might well opt for one of the heat pump options although I believe that the technology and quoted efficiencies are not quite there yet. Obviously DHW can be served by solar but that is a very small proportion of the total heat demand.

    It would be possible to increase the loft insulation above the existing ~350mm but the benefits of doing so are marginal. The house is already cavity insulated and has double glazing. We could certainly upgrade the windows (double glazed but 20 years old) but I'd estimate the cost at around £40k.

    Pellets are only worthwhile financially if the RHI is implemented as the capital cost is considerable and the green credentials although better than kerosene are not that brilliant.

    This is a large house and we only heat the parts we (2 of us most of the time) live in. The heating controls are good even though the existing boiler is not.

    Mike.
  7.  
    Mike.B,
    I have exactly the same situation, went down same line of thinking as you.
    Installed a Daikin 2-stage ASHP last August (Daikin Altherma HT 16kW)
    So far it is happy running the existing rads at 75C.
    Real-world CoP based on meter readings to date is about 2.5 - 2.7
    Cost £11k installed. More than an oil boiler, but dont forget cost of installing an oil tank and filling it up with oil (several £k tied up there)
    Much cheaper to run than oil (saving £1k/year) and lots of CO2
    Is quite noisy
    Am pretty pleased with it overall
    I posted some data and opinions about it on other threads
  8.  
    Back on topic,
    BBC 'Farming today' had a report that straw prices for farmers are now very high, alledgedly because so much straw is being burned in power stations
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01cwvns/Farming_Today_09_03_2012/
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeMar 9th 2012
     
    Posted By: WillInAberdeenBBC 'Farming today'

    Yes, heard it to, how many sheps did the Farmers mate have who was spending a £1000 a week on straw? Lots I should think.

    We shall have to see if the new Super dairy Heard on the Archers makes a mention of this.
  9.  
    Combustion of straw brings concerns , chlorine content 20 times higher than alternative biomass. Chlorine indicates highly carcinogenic furans and dioxins in emissions. Sulphur content produces SO2 levels typically 60 times higher than equivalent gas with the most hazardous pollutant fine particles typically 30 times higher than gas.
    Straw sustainability causes concern with 40% yield variation ,25% can be rendered unsuitable for purpose during storage and typically 12% lost due to arson. The current ROC payment indicates plant operator will receive £83 per tonne burned on top of payment for power sold to the grid.
    Interesting to note a plant operator claiming generosity in contracted payment of £10 million for 240,000 tonnes of straw delivered to powerplant but current subsidy would indicate income of £19,910 ,000 for burning biomass.
    On a visit to Nth Wales a local dairy farmer expressed alarm at the proposal to burn large quantities of straw when he was already struggling to source animal bedding. Straw also features in construction and it could be considered prudent to plough in straw to avoid use of fossil fuel based fertilisers.
    Reference superdairies the Lincolnshire project for 4000- 8000 animals on one dairy site detailed proposed use of sand for bedding with food to be primarily waste from 1million tonne wheat to ethanol plant together with brewery waste plus lucerne. The application was rejected
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteamyTea
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2012 edited
     
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2012
     
    Interesting. Has ramifications for a local scheme to convert Buildwas to biomass, being touted as "low CO2".

    Watch this space?
    • CommentAuthorbillt
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2012
     
    When my parents moved back to Shropshire in 1974, Buildwas power station was going to be closed in a year or two, because of the local air pollution. It's been going to close in a year or two ever since and definitely by 2015.

    40 years on it seems that it's going to be burning biomass, no doubt with just as much pollution!
   
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